T-5 Tranny Case Assembly Help!

[stangman16]

Hello,
I'm trying to put back together my '91 T-5 Tranny so I can drop it back in the '66 mustang. I'm stuck on getting the rear part of the case on, along with the top cover. I can't seem to get it to align right for the pin hole on the shift shaft where you need to drive in the pin at. The book says to put all gears in neutral and slowly let down the cover into the case... i've tried many a times and still no success. Can anyone tell me how I need to do this to get this complete?

Is there a way I can upload an image of this from my computer so you can see what I am referring to?

Thanks for any advice you can give... I just want to get this pony back on the road again!

 

[proxses]

If you are trying to put the top cover on. First make sure the tailshaft is not on it. This would make it a real pain to work with. If it's not off, drive the pin out of the block that your shifter slides into. Then the tailshaft can be pulled from the top cover.
Now, the cover need to be slightly to the right for the forks to line up. As you lower it, the forks sould engage the sliders, and the top will center itself as it comes to rest on the case.
Once you have the top cover on, then you can put the tailshaft back on. I like to put the tranny in 4th for this. That way the selector block (the thing the shifter rests in) can be hammered onto the selector shaft. Make sure you have the tension spring and ball bearing in place before the tailshaft goes on. It's a real pain the first time. But it's not bad once you have done it before. At this point the press pin for the selector block should be able to be hammered in.

Does this help?

If not try to post a pic using the attachments.

 

[stangman16]

Here is my problem... I just can't get it right, I've tried different ways to get it but it comes out like this:

To put this in 4th gear, do I need to press the slider forward as indicated by the red arrows? Do this prior to putting on the top cover? When I put on the top case after it sits on the housing, I have to push it towards the tailshaft about 3/8" -> 1/4" to get the bolt holes lined up. I've tried doing this with it in neutral. Can you tell me if there is a certain way this has to go in at? As far as that key is concerned?

There was a spacer I took out that goes to the 4th gear synchro where I have the individual type bearings (16 count I believe) I took that spacer out (inside where green arrow is) because with it in the Transmission was locked. I don't know how it was in there first, but i'm afriad I'll probably end up needing it. Just if I do, why does the tranny lock? And without the spacer the tranny gears seem to line up more perfectly.

Thanks for the reply - 1st T-5 / tranny rebuild

 

[Mustang5L5]

I'm just gonna replay here for now.

In the morning, i'll look up this post and tell you how i did mine.

 

[proxses]

Ok, the reason the tranny is locking up is because the preload is not set right. In the front bearing retainer is the bearing race for the input shaft bearing, as well as a few shims to set the preload of the tranny. You might be able to see it under the race. Place the shim back into the tranny, and remove the shim in the bearing retainer. This will free up the tranny so you can work on it. Later you can set the preload.

Make sure the pin in the selector shaft is in line with that circular metal ring in the center of the cover. This should be neutral. Make sure the forks engage the grooves in the sliders. Bolt the cover in place. It may have to move the cover around a bit to line it up. Just spin the tranny to make sure it is not in gear.

And to get everything to line up properly....
Remove the tailshaft housing, and keep the top cover bolted on.
Ensure the tranny is in neutral.
With the hole in the selector shaft facing vertically, push it tward the front of the tranny. This may take some force, but nothing too excessive.
The tranny is now in fourth. To verify, make sure the input shaft turns at the same speed as the main (output) shaft.
Now you can set the tailshaft into place.
As you do guide the shifter block onto the selector shaft. You should be able to hammer it down to the position you need. It is a tight fit.

There are many sites that guide you through the rebuild. I just can't remember what they are.

Let me know how it goes.

 

[proxses]

I just saw the problem!!!
The metal tabs with the, slots cut in them, that are attached to the forks. Those should go over the metal ring in the center of the cover.
In other words, both tabs should be farther to the right in the picture.
That ring that is to the right of the upper tab should be in the slot of the tab. Does that make sense?
You will probably have to pop that pin back out.

Red slot on both tabs lines up with green ring.

 

[stangman16]

Okay, I'll take a look at it when I get out of work. I don't see how the tabs are going to move farther to the right, but I'll try and make it happen.

Also, where are the Shims that you are referring to? I'll put that spacer back into the correct location where the bearing is at for 4th gear. I just don't know exactly where the shim is that you're referring to...? Also, if I take out that shim, how do I measure and correct the preload?

Thanks for the reply!

So, drive the pin out and move both arms forward about 1-2" to line up with that piece... hope i can get it to go forward some. When I took this thing apart I did not mess with that cover, I figured it would go on without me having to modify it... I guess I was wrong... Thanks for the reply!

 

[Mustang5L5]

See the beveled end of the shift rail in this picture? It should be INSIDE the top cover to the far right. The whole shift rail needs to slide in another 1/2" - 3/4"

Something is assembled wrong in the shifter forks setup. It doesn't look right to me

Do you have the service manual

http://www.ttcautomotive.com/English/media/pdfs_autogen/T-5_Service_Manual.pdf

Read page 7-9. It gives you a step by step on how to assemble the top cover. Judging from your picture, the small c-ring isn't sitting in the right relationship to the block with the pin in it. The pin should rest in the gap in the c-clip with the two shift fork plate's grooves over the c-clip

EDIT: I just read you did not take the cover and shift assembly apart. Something must have slipped out of position. Before taking it all aprt, see if you can get the 1-2 shift fork plate's groove to rest on the c-clip. It looks like that fell out of position

This is exactly what your problem is

[/
The slots on the shift fork plates are supposed to slide around the c-clip with the pin resting in the gap. Take a look at figure 7-17 and 7-18 in the service manual and you'll see exactly how it should fit. You might be able to slide them back into their locations without taking the assembly apart

 

[stangman16]

Okay, Finally figured out how to get the cover on with the shifter pin hole ligning up... now... after I get the bolts torqued down on the tailhousing, I go to try and turn the tranny and it is locked ...go figure. I had removed the only 2 shims that were in the input shaft piece underneath the bearing retainer... The only thing I can think of is to put those two back, and remove the spacer that goes in the 4th gear area. I don't see how I can take this thing apart and not be able to use all the parts to put it back together again... all I did was change the dogs for 4th and the synchro... Any ideas?

 

[Mustang5L5]

The shims shouldn't really affect the trans locking up.

Since you need to do this anyway, take out the input shaft and all the loose peices. I hope you used petroleum jelly to hold the input shaft roller bearings in place. With the input shaft out, see if you can free the trans up. If not, you'll haave to open the trans again.

Don't worry, i went through the same thing when i did my last T-5.

 

[bbfordguy]

trans problems??????

I had this same problem with mine I have had mine apart a dozen times I am pretty good at these transmissions you do not have the fork selector tower aligned right you need to put trans into neutral then hold fork tower upright and position the forks so the pin lines straight up then at a little angle you need to position tower to one side and then slide it to the left when you set the forks onto the collars undernieth the 5th gear selecor on the left of trans

 

[bbfordguy]

you need to have a little freeplay in the input b4 you put the tail shaft houseing on it will all tighten up when you put it together

 

[bbfordguy]

do it without the shims first

 

[proxses]

Well, the reason the tranny is locking up is because there is too much preload on the shafts. Friction is holding them from moving.
You need a dial indicator to measure preload, or endplay, depending on who you talk to.
But if it is locked even with the shims from under the input bearing race removed, the I guess you don't need the one at fourth.

Could you take a pic of the shims from the bearing retainer, and the one from fourth?
I might be able to see if we are talking about the same thing.

 

[four.six]

I'll get a picture snapped and posted later tonight after work. I'll then take out that spacer and put the tranny together to see if it is locked. Thanks!

 

[stangman16]

ooops... i was logged in on my friends PC and his U/N. I'll get a picture snapped and posted later tonight after work. I'll then take out that spacer and put the tranny together to see if it is locked and leave the shims in place for the input shaft. There is petroleum jelly for the roller bearings . Thanks!

 

[stangman16]

update on situation...

Okay... I replaced the two shims that are shown in these 2 pictures back into the input shaft housing, and I removed the spacer (held in my hand) and put back together the transmission. It is not locked now, seems to be okay. If I do not need this spacer, I am to ask why it was there (and how) in the first place? It just stumbles me so, that whatever I work on this car, things just don't seem to go as planned.

How do you check endplay? I have feeler gauges, but I don't know what to do from there. The tranny seems to be a tight fit, if I were to push on the input shaft or on the output shaft, I cannot feel any movement.

 

[Mustang5L5]

See these two rings in the front of the picture? Those are the shims. WHat you want to do is assemble the transmission leaving these two shims out.

Now, check the link i posted above if you don't have the T-5 service manual. It's page 7-11 and 7-12.

A quick check to see if you have endplay is, with the trans assembled, grab hold of the input and output shaft together and see if you can move them together front and back inside the trans. If you do, you need to ad shims until you get 0.000 endplay.

 

[stangman16]

I've taken out both shims and left in the spacer and when I put back together the tranny it is locked. If I remove that spacer and place the shims back in, it does not feel as though, when i hold the input shaft and output shaft, that they move. Is that spacer absolutely necessary? Should I place that back in? If so, where are there other shims to remove? All I've removed are the ones to the input shaft.

 

[Mustang5L5]

What parts inside the trans did you replace? Did you just do a basic rebuild? Or did you replace any gears or shafts?

Most likely, you need to install all the shims that were previously there to get proper lash. Usually, the only time you need to reshim is if you install new bearing retainer or a whole new input shaft.

If you have the bearing retainer off, will the trans spin? Whgat about if you pull the input shaft off? Will it spin then? I'm starting to think something is interferring.

Just a hunch, if the trans spins with the bearing retainer off, but locked with it in, i think one of the bolts is going in too far and hitting the front gear on the countergear. I noticed that it was pretty close my last time in a trans.