Tail Shaft won't go on

Lawbreaker5.0 · Nov 14, 2009

k. thanks. i can borrow a nice dial indicator from a friend, hopefully he has the clamp on type.

v8only · Nov 14, 2009

any type will work, so long as you get a measurement...have fun!

Lawbreaker5.0 · Nov 14, 2009

thanks, hopefully this time i can solve the clutch chatter ( the reason i took all this out in the first place).

once again thanks for your help.

v8only · Nov 14, 2009

spec clutch??

make sure you observe proper break in period, your flywheel and pp are good and surfaced....

certain clutches like specs are proned to chatter. A king cobra clutch on the other hand, usually never chatters

Lawbreaker5.0 · Nov 14, 2009

yeah this is the mongoose clutch. i said what the heck and decided to give it a shot. its suppose to be the cobra clone and it is made out of organic material. The flywheel was resurfaced and it came with a new pp. the only thing that was giving me problems was the fork was barely on ball. and i didn't greese the tailshaft or new TO bearing.

I got a new fork, so hopefully this fixes it, plus i'm going back to stock clutch cable and and MM quad and firewall. The pedal just never felt right, real jumpy as it went down and felt like it stopped halfway. i really hope it fixes it.

v8only · Nov 14, 2009

t/o bearing doesn't need grease, it's all pre greased. you can put a dab on the pivot ball.

If you really want to grease the bearing, do it extremely lightly, as it will sling grease onto your clutch disc

Lawbreaker5.0 · Nov 18, 2009

i might be reading side to side play cuz at this point i have 30 thousandths of play. i don't know if i'm doing it right either cuz every tiny movement shows on the dial indicator.

v8only · Nov 18, 2009

set it up on the output shaft instead...no side to side play there

Lawbreaker5.0 · Nov 18, 2009

yeah i just finished, my dumbass was trying to read it with the tail shaft off. i put the tailshaft on and there is zero play,

thanks v8only

on a side note. its a bich to put that tailshaft on with one person trying to hold the ball and the spring together, anyways i got it but man i was getting a little frustrated

v8only · Nov 19, 2009

tailshaft off, lol..3000000 play!

Lawbreaker5.0 · Nov 27, 2009

so i finally got the trans back and i hook up the new MaximumMotosport Quadrant and preceeded to connect the stock non adjustable clutch cable to the fork. i don't think there is any production difference in the bbk and the MM firewall adjuster so i didn't buy the MM FW. i kept the BBK fW adj. I switched over because supposedly you can use a stock cable with MM quad (and firewall adj) and will allow you a soft pedal and not the crappy fealing AF cables.

Well the firewall was previously adjusted almost 2 in out and i didn't screw it back down, just jumped under neath to pry the fork back to make the cable connect to the fork. Well i noticed the problem right then, i didn't even need to pry the fork, i just gentle moved it forward and slid the cable back through. The pedal had a lot of slack so i turned the FW adj out a couple turns. Until i left the recommended gap that MM instruction sheet says. The pedal is soft and feels great going down, but the trans won't go in first or reverse easily. every now and then i got it end which was weird. but then the other gears didn't feel right . so i turned the FW out some more and got almost all the slack out of the cable and it didn't really help. Anyone or V8only know what i could be doing wrong.

I had a 25+ year tech put the clutch and trans in, because i recently pulled a ligament in my hand, so i highlydoubt he put it in wrong. how can i go about diagnosing this problem?

the clutch is a Moongoose (yeah, yeah, i know its cheap but i was told that its a king cobra with out the ford name behind it so i took a chance)

thanks

v8only · Nov 27, 2009

does the trans shift through the gears fine with the engine off?? If not, you have a trans problem. If it shifts fine through the gears with the motor off, but hangs with the engine running, it's only one of two things...a cable/adjustment problem, or a clutch problem.

your issue is typical of a clutch that's not adjusted properly, but I've also seen it due to a bad pressure plate. SAFELY jack the car up use jack stands, pull the fork cover off, (have it in neutral)have a friend depress the clutch. if the fork moves nearly to the back of the bell housing, then you've got a clutch issue...if the fork doesn't travel all of the way, your clutch adjustment is too loose or you've got a cable issue.

Lawbreaker5.0 · Nov 28, 2009

thanks, for the fast response. i will check that when i get off work at 4pm today. hopefully the girlfriend is capable of pushing in the clutch while i'm underneath it. lol.

WHen you say it should go in gears with the car off, you're talking about not pushing the clutch in right? just shifting through them?

v8only · Nov 28, 2009

clutch in or out, doesn't make a difference...as long as it shifts with the engine off--go ahead and depress the clutch with the engine off and row through the gears.

Lawbreaker5.0 · Nov 28, 2009

amnit: won't go in 1st or Reverse with engine off and clutch pressed in. Even 2nd felt like a clunk, clunk going in, didn't feel normal. 3rd, 4th, 5th go in smoothly.

I never messed with the internals of the trans so i couldn't have messed anything up, could I? The tech that tried to fig out how to put the lid on the trans was using a screw driver and sorts to line things back up so i don't know if he screwed up the lid(parts that go with it).

Oh Man, i've been working on this car (upgrading) over a year now, i really thought this was it.

Now What? anyway to go about diagnosing 1st and Reverse?

i went through all the gears when i mocked it up the first time without the rtv on the lid and tailshaft and i think they felt fine (can't really remember but i know they all went into gear). then i pulled it off and rtv'd it and put the lid exactly like you said the first time and the time i mocked it up and i don't rememeber checking all the gears that time but i did it to a T.

Mustang5L5 · Nov 28, 2009

Most probs lie in the lid. There is a trick to installing it. Did you disassemble any of the keys and suck on the shift forks? Usually when i do trans and don't touch anything on the shift rail, i lift the lid off and then set it aside and don't touch it til i put it back on.

When you install the lid, put all the synchros in nuetral. Then lower the lid down until the shift forks touch their respective synchros. Not shift the lid about 2" to the pass side of the trans and then lower it down all the way. Once the lid meets the case, shift it back to the driver's side and line up the bolts. That's really the onle way to do it.

Of course, this assumes the keys and such are installed correctly. Honestly, they are a PITA if they fall out or become misaligned. Even i struggle with them and i've done a number of T-5's to the point where I don't need a manual anymore. I do however for the shift rail keys.

I just took a t-5 apart today where the input shaft, countergear, and every gear including 5th gear is mashed up! Metal shavings were everywhere to the point where it looked like a grey sludge was coating everything. I now have a bunch of baggies of misc parts and an empty case....Hmm...How mnuch are those Astro T-5 kits going for?

Lawbreaker5.0 · Nov 28, 2009

Mustang5L5 said:
Most probs lie in the lid. There is a trick to installing it. Did you disassemble any of the keys and suck on the shift forks? Usually when i do trans and don't touch anything on the shift rail, i lift the lid off and then set it aside and don't touch it til i put it back on.

When you install the lid, put all the synchros in nuetral. Then lower the lid down until the shift forks touch their respective synchros. Not shift the lid about 2" to the pass side of the trans and then lower it down all the way. Once the lid meets the case, shift it back to the driver's side and line up the bolts. That's really the onle way to do it.

Of course, this assumes the keys and such are installed correctly. Honestly, they are a PITA if they fall out or become misaligned. Even i struggle with them and i've done a number of T-5's to the point where I don't need a manual anymore. I do however for the shift rail keys.

I just took a t-5 apart today where the input shaft, countergear, and every gear including 5th gear is mashed up! Metal shavings were everywhere to the point where it looked like a grey sludge was coating everything. I now have a bunch of baggies of misc parts and an empty case....Hmm...How mnuch are those Astro T-5 kits going for?

yeah i never dis assembled the lid. At one point the shaft was not connected to the the end where the plug is on the lid, but i finally got it through the Horseshoe thingy and the shaft went bact into its crevice in the lid.

i mocked it up and everything and went through the gears, the only thing i could have done was left it in gear and placed the lid back down when it wasn't in neutral the second time with rtv. i just looked underneath the car and notice some drippage between the tailshaft and case so it would have to come out again anyway, but i really wanted to drive it as its been over a year. i've really never experience what my car feels like with the HCI, new cobra brakes, LCA and UPP and the mickey thompson.

so hopefully ya'll understand my frustration. just about 4k into it and still haven't really driven her, no big deal, lol

Lawbreaker5.0 · Nov 28, 2009

so since i got it in 1st gear atleast once and reverse as well, its still a lid issue?

also do yall use red high temp gasket stuff or the black rtv?

i just read the T5 rebuilding manual and it seems pretty easy to dis assemble and assemble, i'm wondering if the hard part is finding the parts that are bad and need replacement. a buddy of mine told me a lot of it has to do with a feeler guage and tolerances?

v8only · Nov 28, 2009

I prefer black rtv

pull it apart and pull the lid and slide the slider between 1 and 2, then the other one 3 and 4, then 5 and r, doing this all manually. Rotate it and check to be sure the keys are all there and not broken.

once you've checked this, put the lid and tail on, and bench shift it a billion times to make sure it's good.

Mustang5L5 · Nov 28, 2009

The only stuff you need the endplay gauge for is when you install the countergear and measuring play in the input and mainshaft. Other than that, all the other inspections are purely visual.

Mopstly you just look over the gears and their dog teeth and sliders and replace any that show wear. The reverse teeth tend to round over as well. Usually the reverse idler is always well rounded over. $30 or so for a new one on ebay. Also check the mainshaft tip where the 15 small roller bearings run. I've seen these score up and they make a hum noise when they do. Basically if anything looks worn, replace it. All the dog teeth should look crisp, sharp and semetrical. If one side looks damager or the heads are starting to round over, replace them...same goes for the blocker rings, but those are usually replaced in a rebuild anyway.

It's pretty much all visual inspection. The mainshaft goes together 1 way pretty much,and most of it is snap ringed in place, so tolerances aren't key really. The import thing is shimming the countergear and the input shaft correctly. Everything else is pretty easy.

Tail Shaft won't go on

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