Top End Cleaner/Seafoam--Opinions?

  • Sponsors (?)


Jeremiah,

I don't believe in fix-its in a bottle. If you have a serious engine problem Sea Foam (or whatever) will not help you one bit. On the other hand Ford sells their own brand of "sea foam". I think it's called "carb tune up" or some such thing. I was a driveability tech at a Ford/Mercury/Lincoln and have seen some situations where it will free up a sticking valve or eliminate a cold start problem when valves are caked with carbon (carbon absorbs fuel and diverts the rest of the fuel in an unwanted spray path).

One example that comes to mind is when I had a 98 explorer that came in with a cold start problem (160000 miles). I would start it at 7AM when it was cold. It would run like crap almost like it was only running on 2 cylinders. Then after 10 seconds it would completely clear up. I could not look at any PIDS because the symptom went away fast. I was convinced that this was a carbon build up problem. If someone were to ask me to describe a carbon problem this would be a text book symptom. Decarbed the engine and it still happened. The 4.6/5.4 engines are hard to decarb so I tried it a few more times. The symptoms got worse. So, I stuck a borescope down the #1 injector hole. Their was still a bunch of carbon on the intake valve. So I pulled off the intake and cleaned the valves with a pick and cleaner. Got everything back together and it ran worse than ever! Would act up 3-4 times a day and for a longer duration. At this point, I was able to isolate the problem. The EGR was actually opening then closing after a few seconds. This just goes to show that it improved manifold vac that much.

I'm also reminded of a story of a Pontiac that had a miss fire. I suspected a sticking valve. If you have ever worked on a DOHC quad 4 you they suck. That and your suposed to have special tools to work on them. So I did a decarb. The miss went away.

Like I say I'm not endorsing the product but it also seems to not hurt anything. I can tell you that the hotter you get the engine the better. I'm not saying take a belt off... Run the engine at fast idle and suck the stuff through the brake booster vac line. Then let the engine stall and let the stuff sit for at least 15 mins. Make sure you are in a well ventilated area because you will definately have white smoke. And a lot of it.
 
Mike, just the man I wanted to grab on one of these threads...............

Are there adverse effects of seafoaming with Cats and O2's? I seem to recall that it says it's safe for one or the other but figured you know for sure. I get kinda hinky seein all that smoke and possible pieces of carbon going into the cat's substrate.

Jeremiah - I will say that back in the day (way back), before a plug change, I'd run some aerated water through the carb - basically the same function as Seafoam and other top end cleaners. Dont know if it helped for sure, but it seemed to.

I occasionally use Seafoam but I'm kind of a weenie - some folks bog the motor with it till it stalls - I wont do that. I will let it sit on the piston tops for a bit though.

Good luck.
 
HISSIN50 said:
Mike, just the man I wanted to grab on one of these threads...............

Are there adverse effects of seafoaming with Cats and O2's? I seem to recall that it says it's safe for one or the other but figured you know for sure. I get kinda hinky seein all that smoke and possible pieces of carbon going into the cat's substrate.


JT,

If I remember correctly, it is sensor friendly (I tried to see if an empty can around here but it's been a while since I used the stuff). Even if you run lead based fuel, it takes 1000+ miles for your 02s to go out. I don't see any major problems with using it once or twice. The cats on the other hand may be another story. By defination a catalyst is someting that changes something else without being consumed. In a perfect world we would not ever have a catcon failure. However, this is real life. So we do get things like excessive HCs. I've seen cat failures because someone simply liked WOT too much. So for this I'm going to have to say that it is probable that it may damage the converter. But if it's used only once..... I really don't know what this stuff is made of so this is just an uneducated guess. Most of the things of this nature are labled as "petrollium distilates".
 
giddyup306 said:
JT,

If I remember correctly, it is sensor friendly (I tried to see if an empty can around here but it's been a while since I used the stuff). Even if you run lead based fuel, it takes 1000+ miles for your 02s to go out. I don't see any major problems with using it once or twice. The cats on the other hand may be another story. By defination a catalyst is someting that changes something else without being consumed. In a perfect world we would not ever have a catcon failure. However, this is real life. So we do get things like excessive HCs. I've seen cat failures because someone simply liked WOT too much. So for this I'm going to have to say that it is probable that it may damage the converter. But if it's used only once..... I really don't know what this stuff is made of so this is just an uneducated guess. Most of the things of this nature are labled as "petrollium distilates".
Thank you Mike. :nice:

I figured since it was perhaps used upon occasion at the dealership, you'd know if Ford wanted the H-pipe disconnected prior to Top-end cleaner use.
You and I are of same mind - it might not hurt (and there's plenty of things that can take out a cat) but it's probably wise to not accelerate the process.

Thank you very much for the reply. And it's great to see ya back in here. :nice:
 
Roland, as I recall, E/G takes out sensors. So I kinda doubt it's primary ingredient is that (but I have no idea). I bet there's some toleune in there and other solventy type stuff (PD's that Mike mentioned).
 
I'm not familiar with seafoam but I just ran some "top end cleaner" made by GM through my v6 Taurus that was pinging even on good gas. A lot of smoke and pinging got worse for a bit but now seems to have went away. It said to shut down the "AIR" system if equipped but if I'm right, this is the air injection to the cats. My Taurus doesn't appear to have an air pump like my mustang so I ignored this instruction.
 
Like I say ford makes a similar product but it's curious that it's labled as CARB cleaner. My boss told me that the tech line told him to use the stuff.... I think the reason being was for the longevity of the cats. But you can take that at face value because I'm only 50% sure on that one.
 
all seafoam is, is a smoke show, Ive tried it, its suposed to clean all the carbon out of your engine, but its not like your going to rip it all apart to see if it actually worked, I heard theres chemicals in seafoam to make every car smoke, not more smoke for cars with more carbon. I wouldnt waste your time, you wont notice a difference.
 
Roland69 said:
seafoam's main base is gas line anti-freeze My boss tells me

We will never know exactly what is in this additive, which pisses me off to no end :mad:
Fuel companies justify the "secrecy" by saying that the average consumer won't know the difference, and that they have to protect their "propietary information"

IMHO, every bottle of fuel additive and other automotive additive should atleast have a list of "ingredients"
Anything we add to our engine can have serious affects on how it runs.

If I have a high compression engine (lets say 11:1 as I plan to re-build the 408w), then I will have to stay away from most solvent type additives, as they are likely to cause detonation. The same applies for the extreme boost that some of the 2.3t guys are running.
Maybe I am way off base there, but I think we should know what were adding to our cars.
Then again I am afraid to try Acetone to increase fuel economy.

*stepping off the soapbox*

JT- How do you let seafoam "sit on top of the pistons" ???
However you do it, I doubt I will have the courage to try it :p



I have used seafoam and various other fuel system cleaners with no adverse affects.
I can't say I have seen any improvements though.

jason
 
vristang said:
JT- How do you let seafoam "sit on top of the pistons" ???
However you do it, I doubt I will have the courage to try it :p
Not literally, but it's wishful thinking. I shut the engine off just as I pour some in there (then I pour a little more) - something might make it down there. I suppose I could yank plugs and pour it down the plug hole. I dont know how much volume it takes to hydrolock a motor so I tend to be a real weenie. I've used seafoam a couple times on the stang and assume it will do nothing, so with that mindset, I try to be easy on the stuff.

We've seen pistons on some of these motors - it can take a lot of elbow grease to get the carbon off the piston tops. With my luck, I'd do more harm than good.
 
HISSIN50 said:
We've seen pistons on some of these motors - it can take a lot of elbow grease to get the carbon off the piston tops.

LOL
With all the oil control issues I've had, I know exactly what you mean :rlaugh:

Pistons should look like metal, not charcoal :mad:

As always, thanks for taking the time.


jason
 
The car runs great. The only issue I'm having is detonation/pre-ignition. The car used to run fine on 87 octane and 12*, now it pings at 10* on 87 octane. My thought's were to use a top end cleaner and hopefully set my timing back to 12*.
 
I can attest to Seafoam. I have a pretty stock 5.0 with 107,000 miles. I started getting really crappy gas mileage... 170-190 per tank... 2.73s everything... Anything I have done to the car should make it get BETTER gas mileage. So I suspected the injectors were gummed up. I did the sea foam thing in the brake booster hose, and put 1/3 of the can in my gas tank. Last tank of gas, I got 240 miles. Major improment. And I did the seafoam treatment in the middle of the tank of gas. I'm not saying it's a mircle product, but it did seem to help with the gas mileage. And no.. I did not drive the car any different. I still romped on it many a time.