Twin turbos under the car?
- Thread starter mooktank
- Start date
FrdMustangCpe
New Member
Michael Yount
Mustang Master
"...why? seems way harder to install and crap w/o any gains."
What part of senior design project don't you understand?
mook - I always get intrigued by a different approach to things. I think the piece I'd take a close look at is just how much room you have down there. The turbos probably take up more space than you think - so that's the first thing I'd explore. Since the heat from them is gonna rise, you need to think about how far from the floor pan you could mount them, what that does to ground clearance for the turbo, and how they'll do in an environment where they're being splashed with water (rain). Also, most rely on a gravity drain for oil back to the pan. If you mount them lower than the pan, you're gonna have to figure out how to get the oil back to the sump. The units that are being marketed to replace the rear muffler on F-bodys (not a typo) use a small inline oil pump to return oil from the back of the car/turbo location to the sump. If they're water cooled, you've got coolant circulation questions to answer as well.
Plenty of fodder for a design project -- good luck with it.
What part of senior design project don't you understand?
mook - I always get intrigued by a different approach to things. I think the piece I'd take a close look at is just how much room you have down there. The turbos probably take up more space than you think - so that's the first thing I'd explore. Since the heat from them is gonna rise, you need to think about how far from the floor pan you could mount them, what that does to ground clearance for the turbo, and how they'll do in an environment where they're being splashed with water (rain). Also, most rely on a gravity drain for oil back to the pan. If you mount them lower than the pan, you're gonna have to figure out how to get the oil back to the sump. The units that are being marketed to replace the rear muffler on F-bodys (not a typo) use a small inline oil pump to return oil from the back of the car/turbo location to the sump. If they're water cooled, you've got coolant circulation questions to answer as well.
Plenty of fodder for a design project -- good luck with it.
BullittStangV8
Founding Member
also dont forget that you will have to have your air intakes away from the ground, possibly back into the engine bay, so that you done flood them. So your gonna somehow going to have to run intake from the engine area back to the exuast and back to the intake. also an intercooler will have to make it into the bay as well. i think it will be pretty cool if you could do it.
Mike
Mike
Michael Yount said:"...why? seems way harder to install and crap w/o any gains."
What part of senior design project don't you understand?
mook - I always get intrigued by a different approach to things. I think the piece I'd take a close look at is just how much room you have down there. The turbos probably take up more space than you think - so that's the first thing I'd explore. Since the heat from them is gonna rise, you need to think about how far from the floor pan you could mount them, what that does to ground clearance for the turbo, and how they'll do in an environment where they're being splashed with water (rain). Also, most rely on a gravity drain for oil back to the pan. If you mount them lower than the pan, you're gonna have to figure out how to get the oil back to the sump. The units that are being marketed to replace the rear muffler on F-bodys (not a typo) use a small inline oil pump to return oil from the back of the car/turbo location to the sump. If they're water cooled, you've got coolant circulation questions to answer as well.
Plenty of fodder for a design project -- good luck with it.
do you have a link to the turbo replaceing the muffler on a 5.0 mustang not a comaro?
I was thinking of mounting the intakes out to the side maybe in their own little boxes. I dont take the stang off roading so i think shed be ok. Thing is though i have thought about the oil drains and i think i could get them above the oil pan. It would just be cool becuase even if you opened your hood noone would know why you kicked their ass. (just run the tubing from the intercooler through the fender and theyll think it's a CAI) A REAL SLEEPER!!! Then again I was thinking it would be easier too instead of moving tons of stuff in the engine bay.
Michael Yount
Mustang Master
You may want to pick up one of the current sport compact mags on the stands - Turbo, or something like that. They have an in depth article on the systems that mount all the way at the back of the vehicle - behind the rear axle. The route the discharge as you describe - in through the fender like a CAI. So under the hood you see nothing at all. All the turbo/plumbing is at the rear of the car. They claim it's not a problem, but lag concerns me the further that turbo(s) is away from the throttle.
BullittStangV8
Founding Member
lags always going to happen regarless in any turbo. but since the flow is the flow regarless of where in the exaust it is (after header of after mid pipe) it seems like the difference would only be the difference in time that it would take the gas to travel the extra distance.
btw i would mount the filters in the fenderwell, not under the car. Under the car any little puddle could flood the filter. at least in the fenderwell there is some protection from it.
my route would be: filter in the fenderwell, back to the tubos just after the headers, back to the front for the intercooler, then out the fenderwell where the CAI's go. Dont forget you will need a BOV as well.
i think this could be awsome
Mike
btw i would mount the filters in the fenderwell, not under the car. Under the car any little puddle could flood the filter. at least in the fenderwell there is some protection from it.
my route would be: filter in the fenderwell, back to the tubos just after the headers, back to the front for the intercooler, then out the fenderwell where the CAI's go. Dont forget you will need a BOV as well.
i think this could be awsome
Mike
ricer-roni
New Member
- Aug 2, 2004
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I have a buddy that has the turbo mounted in the fenderwall, and he also has the nos solenoids and everything out of sight. lift that hood and it looks bone stock, but a CAI tube, or so you think. Its a sick setup, but you'll never hide the whine.
BullittStangV8 said:
flow isn't flow, regardless. unless the piping was small enough, the velocity of the gases could, and most likely would, slow down considerably. which would also increase lag time. it's not quantity, it's quality, in a sense. and the BOV thing isn't true, it's highly recommended due to the possibility of compressor surge, but it's not absolutely neccessary. and every turbo isn't going to lag, it's all dependent on how much exhaust is flowing..big cube v8s aren't gonna have any lag with a small turbo like a t25 or a t3. there are even antilag kits. some stock cars spool right off idle.
Legendary
Founding Member
Incon Systems had a kit that allowed you to keep the headers headed in the stock position and the turbos sat right after them. I caused for you to 'notch the frame' as the put it but it was a very clean looking install. They're out of business now and I can't find the pic anymore.
Zrated383
New Member
Michael Yount
Mustang Master
Dead serious Zrated - I was pretty surprised too. Imagine looking under the back of an F-body where you'd expect to see a Flowmaster, and seeing a turbo as well as the air filter for it.
BullitStang said - "lags always going to happen regarless in any turbo." Lag is VERY manageable with proper design. Proximity of turbo to the engine on the exhaust side, proximity of the compressor side to the throttle body, and design of both wheels (exhaust turbine and the compressor) are all key to minimizing lag. For racers, it's usually a non-issue. But for street cars it makes the difference between one that's really fun, and one that's undrivable.
BullitStang said - "lags always going to happen regarless in any turbo." Lag is VERY manageable with proper design. Proximity of turbo to the engine on the exhaust side, proximity of the compressor side to the throttle body, and design of both wheels (exhaust turbine and the compressor) are all key to minimizing lag. For racers, it's usually a non-issue. But for street cars it makes the difference between one that's really fun, and one that's undrivable.
As a fellow engineering student, remember that form follows function. Engineering isnt just the difficulty, but also the practicality. Installing turbos aft of the headers underneath the car raise all sorts of issues that have been mentioned. If you want twin turbos, want a project, and want to hide them, then consider in the fenderwells. Having to use a remote oil pump, augmenting the cooling system maybe, added lines everywhere, ground clearance, and added weight may add too much to a job that could be much easier but still illusive.
