VIDEO PROOF of driveability issues. Advice needed..

281pony

Active Member

Aug 31, 2003

2,681

2

46

Oly, WA

Apr 22, 2011

#1

• Apr 22, 2011

• #1

i have major fuel issues, see video.. the entire time the car is held to the floor trying to limp it home from work. the wideband and the nasty nasty on/off power are audible and visible.

this happened from the car running normally after i simply moved the ecu from the passenger footwell back into the spot behind the kick panel.

we have been over ALL sensors and checked voltages, ect in the past 2 days. this seems ignition related, so anyone electrically savy... what wires do you think/does this seem like?

it did this 3x before i got close enough to think of filming it. i got it to re-start by wiggling all the wiring near the ecu.

enjoy? i guess...

YouTube - ford electrical is awesome

 

Rick 91GT

Mustang Master

Nov 29, 1999

9,692

95

99

PA

Apr 22, 2011

#2

• Apr 22, 2011

• #2

WOW.....that is very weird. An idea I had was to check to make sure none of the pins are pulling out at the ECU connector, maybe its a bad connection. Only time I have ever had a car act remotely close to that was a MAF issue, but it would never really get good and drive.

That would drive me nuts...electric issues are my only worry when I build cars and start hiding wires.

 

BlackGT89

Member

Dec 16, 2002

774

8

18

Huntsville, AL

Apr 22, 2011

#3

• Apr 22, 2011

• #3

Wow, that must be quite annoying ! The way that tach drops I would suspect your TFI Inition Module. Is it worse after the car gets hot ? If not that, maybe the PIP (Hall Effect Sensor) in the distributor. Looks and sounds like something is pulling the plug on your ignition system intermittantly.

I would check all of your computer grounds well. If you have an aftermarket ignition system I would try and bypass that as a test.

 

281pony

Active Member

Aug 31, 2003

2,681

2

46

Oly, WA

Apr 22, 2011

#4

• Apr 22, 2011

• #4

we have been over all the wires for loose or pulling out wiring.

i have tried 2 other stock distributors. the car would run fine all the time, except when i tried to get on it. the car would have NO power at all.

this distributor has a bad main shaft bearing and the pip is getting rubbed when it spins by 3 of the fingers. yet, it has a brand new tfi module. it does this cold or hot..

it only started doing this again when i moved the ECU back into the factory location. so that makes me think wiring, but it also matches what i know is wrong with my distributor you described.

we went over grounds and everything with the ecu in prior testing. so i guess i will just try and tackle searching the wiring again and how it sits when the ecu is in the footwell vs in the fender area. i dont know anymore, i just wanted someone to see a video so they know what i'm dealing with.

 

f8tlfiveo

My wife likes my spool and blow-off valve.

Aug 8, 2007

1,585

102

64

Lancaster, PA

Apr 23, 2011

#5

• Apr 23, 2011

• #5

So it does this hot or cold then? I had issues a couple of weeks ago when my car was being tuned. Sort of similar to what I saw in the video. How far does the afr go down? Mine would go to the bottom of the gauge and run stupid. Then if I floored it in neutral it would bring it back up. Then happen all over again. It only happened in closed loop because the o2's were controlling the fuel. Turns out the hego ground( I think pin 49 orange wire) was not connected. It is located on one of the top bolts on the trans in my car. I must have missed it when I put the clutch in. It also had no 12 v signal to the o2 heaters which was weird. So I ran a new wire for that now it runs great. Just somthing to check if you have the computer out. I just ohm'd out all the wires in the o2 harness, than the hego ground till I found the problem. Good luck.

 

281pony

Active Member

Aug 31, 2003

2,681

2

46

Oly, WA

Apr 23, 2011

#6

• Apr 23, 2011

• #6

Went over all o2 wiring on the past days. The o2s themselves are also new. I'm going to look around more today. Perhaps ill just get a new wiring harness and re-hide it

 

281pony

Active Member

Aug 31, 2003

2,681

2

46

Oly, WA

Apr 23, 2011

#7

• Apr 23, 2011

• #7

i have tried 2 different ecu's in prior attempts at fixing this. no difference at all, with and without my chip in this current ecu. i don't believe it is the ecu after this. i already shook it while driving before too without issues.

it had something to do with the wiring mess behind the kick panel. there is just the ecu harness and a couple connectors. the guy who has done all ths electrical testing for me is coming back tomorrow to figure it out.

he is confident we will find it now and fix it once and for all. i refuse to do much with electrical, but i'm going to look for frayed/exposed/broken wires today. ill lay it back on the floor and see if it goes back to normal atleast.

last resort, i will get an entirely new wiring harness. i'm not worried about money or what it is really, just tired of this fixed/broken bs. i just want to drive the car, opening day was yesterday at the track ffs! shouldn't be at this point with the car. i spent so much time and money on it ALL winter/spring.

 

281pony

Active Member

Aug 31, 2003

2,681

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46

Oly, WA

Apr 23, 2011

#8

• Apr 23, 2011

• #8

ok, here is some GOOD information i feel for anyone genius on here. jricher? lol.

i moved the wires back out of the kick panel area. got the car running, this issue has an affect on my idle speed, my vacuum at idle/driving and how the idle settles. i moved them again and the car fired back up, it slowly returned to a normal airfuel from being richer, might just be going from the cold tables to warm?

then i got the biggest tip of all, when moving the wires out of the kick area, this triggered the fuel pump to prime. then i got back in, it fired up, the revving ability was noticeably stronger, so i took it back around the block. a/f ratio was back to spot on, then i tried to give it some gas. instantly went rich and fell on it's face.

so out of the handful of connectors and wiring next to the ecu is there a specific diagram that illustrates what each is? i will try to diagnose this myself for now, but remember i suck.. so im looking for a cheat sheet.

 

281pony

Active Member

Aug 31, 2003

2,681

2

46

Oly, WA

Apr 23, 2011

#9

• Apr 23, 2011

• #9

i have been searching for the diagrams im after. i found tmoss' site and veryuseful diagrams. the problem is, my main engine harness does not match his diagram. it shows 2 connectors and a ground on the interior besides the main ecu plug.

my 2 connectors don't match the shape or wire colors of the diagrams. one of the two cnnnectors is listed as the eec power relay, seems to be what i am having issues with.

is there a 93-specific diagram for the main engine harness? i know it's not a one size fits all when you purchase them. differences with mass air, fuel pump relays, ect..

 

BlackGT89

Member

Dec 16, 2002

774

8

18

Huntsville, AL

Apr 24, 2011

#10

• Apr 24, 2011

• #10

281pony said:

we have been over all the wires for loose or pulling out wiring.

i have tried 2 other stock distributors. the car would run fine all the time, except when i tried to get on it. the car would have NO power at all.

this distributor has a bad main shaft bearing and the pip is getting rubbed when it spins by 3 of the fingers. yet, it has a brand new tfi module. it does this cold or hot..

it only started doing this again when i moved the ECU back into the factory location. so that makes me think wiring, but it also matches what i know is wrong with my distributor you described.

we went over grounds and everything with the ecu in prior testing. so i guess i will just try and tackle searching the wiring again and how it sits when the ecu is in the footwell vs in the fender area. i dont know anymore, i just wanted someone to see a video so they know what i'm dealing with.

Click to expand...

If I read that right and the PIP is touching the shutter blade, then that would certainly cause ignition problems. The gap between the two is critical. Also a worn or stretched timing chain could be a factor.

 

Chrome_Rust

Member

Dec 5, 2008

530

1

17

Findlay, Ohio

Apr 24, 2011

#11

• Apr 24, 2011

• #11

I have the facrory ford diagrams from 1993. PM me an e-mail and I will send them.

 

281pony

Active Member

Aug 31, 2003

2,681

2

46

Oly, WA

Apr 24, 2011

#12

• Apr 24, 2011

• #12

thanks guys. incase anyone else ever has this, i *think* this is solved. due to the pain in my ass this has been, i won't say 100% yet. however, it ended up being a bad TFI module on BOTH of the stock distributors i bought, and the major problems seen in this video were from my SCT chip.

the sct chip is tight to the body of the car when its sitting where it's supposed to. when i was driving/pulling on wiring, it was BARELY moving the ecu and thus, BARELY moving the chip. when the chip was moving in the slightest, it was cutting power to the ecu. we could play with it and my fuel pump would stay priming constantly, or prime and then stop, ect.

so that was the major issue. my msd distributor made the car run again with power because it has a new tfi. the other 2 stock distributors made the car run fine at normal throttle application, but had no power past 1/8 throttle. i put a stock dizzy back in today with the new tfi off the msd, and it runs fine again.

so chalk it up to bad luck on multiple parts i was promised worked, and some weird ass touchy chips... and you get a car that runs like nobody has ever seen before. should be fixed now though, knock on wood.

 

BlackGT89

Member

Dec 16, 2002

774

8

18

Huntsville, AL

Apr 25, 2011

#13

• Apr 25, 2011

• #13

Cool ! I hope you got it whipped. Now you can make another video of it kicking up its heels !