Went to track tonight,,need your help

Schlodes · Jul 3, 2004

With the 4.10s, what are your RPMs when you are going through the traps?

Also whats is your 1/8th mile MPH vs your 1/4 mile MPH?

Any decent running car should be able to pull a minimum of 20-21 MPH from the 1/8th to the end [1/4]. If its not then you're laying down up top, and it's very likely too much gear on an internally stock motor that is done making power at 4700 RPM anyways.

Ranchero5.0 · Jul 3, 2004

Dude, what do you expect out of an AOD car with a stock motor? My dad's only ran a 14.0 with a AOD (Performer heads, GT40 intake, E cam 373's and a convertor. Stock AOD cars are so slow that guys think they have something when they put gears in. Buddie's stock AOD Lx vert with 3.27's runs 15.3's consistently. It's the only car he can go rounds in. You ever drive a 2.73 AOD car? 60 mph in low gear and it takes a full city block to get there.

A dyno tune is worthless right now. You need to lower your expectations and go have fun with what you have until you can get better parts. 13's will not happen as it is.

Jamie

willys1 · Jul 3, 2004

Schlodes said:
With the 4.10s, what are your RPMs when you are going through the traps?

Also whats is your 1/8th mile MPH vs your 1/4 mile MPH?

Any decent running car should be able to pull a minimum of 20-21 MPH from the 1/8th to the end [1/4]. If its not then you're laying down up top, and it's very likely too much gear on an internally stock motor that is done making power at 4700 RPM anyways.

Im crossing the line at 5000rpm

willys1 · Jul 3, 2004

Ranchero5.0 said:
Dude, what do you expect out of an AOD car with a stock motor? My dad's only ran a 14.0 with a AOD (Performer heads, GT40 intake, E cam 373's and a convertor. Stock AOD cars are so slow that guys think they have something when they put gears in. Buddie's stock AOD Lx vert with 3.27's runs 15.3's consistently. It's the only car he can go rounds in. You ever drive a 2.73 AOD car? 60 mph in low gear and it takes a full city block to get there.

A dyno tune is worthless right now. You need to lower your expectations and go have fun with what you have until you can get better parts. 13's will not happen as it is.

Jamie

Im gonna do some work to my exhaust system to get more back pressure. ( to put back the low end torque I lost)

Ranchero5.0 · Jul 3, 2004

That may help. With the AOD you need a but load of torque to make it move decently. The gear swap may have hurt you just because now the motor is spending more time spinning parts than making torque.

Jamie

thumper460 · Jul 3, 2004

If the 60 ft is the same as before and the shift points are the same.. and the F/p is pretty good ( as you slowed when you jacked it up) then the ign timing could be too far advanced!! 5K thru the traps is ok, drop the shift points in 1-2 keep the rest as they are.... Now as everyone said... the 60 fts SUX!! the 4.11s will allow an even lower launch rpm and get the car moving easyer!! Dont get pissed on the car when your cutting 2.1 60 fts!! Just think...2.1 and 14.30s right?? 1.80 and 13.70s!! or even a 1.9 and 13.90s !! cool?? get that 60 ft lower!! work on tire pressure, launch rpm ... killer reation time!!

just me................................

Thumper

willys1 · Jul 3, 2004

thumper460 said:
If the 60 ft is the same as before and the shift points are the same.. and the F/p is pretty good ( as you slowed when you jacked it up) then the ign timing could be too far advanced!! 5K thru the traps is ok, drop the shift points in 1-2 keep the rest as they are.... Now as everyone said... the 60 fts SUX!! the 4.11s will allow an even lower launch rpm and get the car moving easyer!! Dont get pissed on the car when your cutting 2.1 60 fts!! Just think...2.1 and 14.30s right?? 1.80 and 13.70s!! or even a 1.9 and 13.90s !! cool?? get that 60 ft lower!! work on tire pressure, launch rpm ... killer reation time!!

just me................................

Thumper

Thanks for the advice,but how do you lower your 60's without adding power?

larrendeuce · Jul 3, 2004

Generally suspension & chassis mods, and slicks.

willys1 · Jul 3, 2004

larrendeuce said:
Generally suspension & chassis mods, and slicks.

Dude I ran the 14.3 with stock suspension,and Nitto DR's.Since then Ive added eibech Drag springs,and Hoosier Quick Time Pros ( they are alot better then Nittos) and I got torque box reinforcements!!

Schlodes · Jul 3, 2004

I suggest trying the stock H pipe one time at the track, with the good suspension parts, and sticky tires, and just see.

I went to the track a few weekends back and my big shiny new off road X pipe didnt do f%^k all for my MPH and definitely did kill off some low end torque to where leaving at 4800 RPM on a 5 speed car w/ 3.73s [2.95 trans] the car would dig in, jump up fer a sec and lie down then go. You can see it on the tape every time I launch the thing.

Last year, I ran 1.84, 13.11 @ 102.74 MPH [& best 60 last year was a 1.78 spinnning some on stock suspension] with my Mac equal lengths, stock H pipe, striaght pipes and tails.

This year went 1.77, 13.14 @ 102.95 MPH, with Mac equal lengths, Off road X, magnaflow straight thru muffs and tails.

I think it was only able to run the same ETs BECAUSE I had the suspension work done...

Weather conditions were smiliar.. track condidtions were similar. On a stock heads/intake/cam etc car, too much exhaust stuff IS overkill in my opinion. At least on my car. If it would have been worth the 10 or so HP over the stock H I would have at the very least went 103.0000000 MPH and didnt. [boy did I try LOL ].

Willys - If you car were mine... either a 28" slick to compensate for the gear, or go back to 3.73s, and try the stock H pipe out at the teack one more time and see. I think you'll be happier. IMHO on a stock heads and cam car, if you are up around 4800 RPM approaching the traps the car isnt doing a whole lot except spinning a bunch of parts because the HP is done and over with by then. Just my thoughts based on what I have seen in a buddies 90 LX w/ an auto. Took very little to go 13.70s - 80s @ 97 MPH... Did have a 3.73 gear and 27" tall Hoosier DOTs.

willys1 · Jul 3, 2004

Schlodes said:
I suggest trying the stock H pipe one time at the track, with the good suspension parts, and sticky tires, and just see.

I went to the track a few weekends back and my big shiny new off road X pipe didnt do f%^k all for my MPH and definitely did kill off some low end torque to where leaving at 4800 RPM on a 5 speed car w/ 3.73s [2.95 trans] the car would dig in, jump up fer a sec and lie down then go. You can see it on the tape every time I launch the thing.

Last year, I ran 1.84, 13.11 @ 102.74 MPH [& best 60 last year was a 1.78 spinnning some on stock suspension] with my Mac equal lengths, stock H pipe, striaght pipes and tails.

This year went 1.77, 13.14 @ 102.95 MPH, with Mac equal lengths, Off road X, magnaflow straight thru muffs and tails.

I think it was only able to run the same ETs BECAUSE I had the suspension work done...

Weather conditions were smiliar.. track condidtions were similar. On a stock heads/intake/cam etc car, too much exhaust stuff IS overkill in my opinion. At least on my car. If it would have been worth the 10 or so HP over the stock H I would have at the very least went 103.0000000 MPH and didnt. [boy did I try LOL ].

Willys - If you car were mine... either a 28" slick to compensate for the gear, or go back to 3.73s, and try the stock H pipe out at the teack one more time and see. I think you'll be happier. IMHO on a stock heads and cam car, if you are up around 4800 RPM approaching the traps the car isnt doing a whole lot except spinning a bunch of parts because the HP is done and over with by then. Just my thoughts based on what I have seen in a buddies 90 LX w/ an auto. Took very little to go 13.70s - 80s @ 97 MPH... Did have a 3.73 gear and 27" tall Hoosier DOTs.

Thanks Schlodes,,I tried E-Mailing you,but it was returned.The thing is,,I told my mechanic I didnt want the old h-pipe,,LOL,,Im gonna ask him if he still has it,he just might!!! But if a 28 inch tall tire will do it,,maybe I'LL try that!! I do like driving around with 410's,,Im gonna try the 28inch tires first!! Believe it or not I like the 410's on the highway because it keeps me honest.

willys1 · Jul 3, 2004

Yeah,the more I think about it,,,,,I very rarely lose off the line,the things an animal out of the hole,even faster cars,but they always pass me when I go into 3rd gear!!

tmoss · Jul 5, 2004

You need to post up all the data from your time slips for the 3:73 and 4:10 track runs. If your crossing the 1/4 at 5,000 rpm that's not too far off from what you want. Running blind on A/F is a crap shoot. My car ran best at 34# with stock heads and my ported lower intake. A dyno tune to baseline and adjust your A/F is a good idea and it will give you the torque curve that I can use to show you the good rpm bands for shifting. If your running the stock cam, have you replaced the timing chain at any point? If so, did you take off the cam valve events? Might be putting the cam on a different Intake Center Line would help torque and power.

Sgt.5point0 · Jul 5, 2004

Schlodes said:
....internally stock motor that is done making power at 4700 RPM anyways.

I'm with Scholdes, I think 5400 RPM is too high of a shift point for your engine.

Back when my 5.0 was mostly stock I had my best times shifting at 5000 RPM (I have a T-5), I actually had worse times when I shifted at 5500 RPM.

I'd say go thru the gears manually with your auto if you know what I mean... maybe AOD's dont do that, dunno. Get a shift light and set it at 5000.

willys1 · Jul 6, 2004

I cant find my slip for 14.3 with my 410's but heres my 14.3 with 373's. R/T=.075// 60ft=2.0// 1/8=9.2 ,76mph//1/4= 14.339 at 96mph. But I did find 14.4's with both sets of gears,here's 373's -R/T=.056//60ft=2.0// 1/8=9.2 at 75mph//1/4=14.409 at 95mph and heres with 410's R/T=.036//60ft=2.1// 1/8=9.2 at 75mph// 1/4=14.469 at 94mph.

Schlodes · Jul 6, 2004

Ok, most good running cars should be able to pull a solid 20 MPH or more, from the 1/8th to the 1/4.

With the 3.73s you were pulling 20 MPH from the 1/8th mile to the 1/4 on both the passes.

With the 4.10 gears you are only pulling 19 MPH. And you had a tad worse 60 foot on the 14.40 pass with the 4.10s [2.1 vs 2.0] which in theory, should have made your MPH a tad better or at least even with the one 95 MPH 3.73 pass. The extra gear IMHO is hurting you up top.

And I still maintain that [especially] with the AOD the lack of back pressure is hurting your 60 foots. I'm very curious as to what one track day with the stock H pipe, and a 28" slicks or 3.73s would change as far as ET and MPH.

Just my thoughts.

>>>>>>>>>>>>
I cant find my slip for 14.3 with my 410's but heres my 14.3 with 373's.
R/T=.075// 60ft=2.0// 1/8=9.2 ,76mph//1/4= 14.339 at 96mph.

But I did find 14.4's with both sets of gears,

here's 373's -R/T=.056//60ft=2.0// 1/8=9.2 at 75mph//1/4=14.409 at 95mph

and heres with 410's R/T=.036//60ft=2.1// 1/8=9.2 at 75mph// 1/4=14.469 at 94mph.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

willys1 · Jul 6, 2004

Hey Schlodes,I called my mechanic,the one who took off my original catted h-pipe,and by luck "he still has it"!! LOL,,so yes,( I cant believe Im doing this!!) Im taking off my off rd BBK H-Pipe,and putting on 4 cats!!PPPFFFF!! Well,Im actually just doing an expieriment,because I am getting a set of Thumper heads in the future.And also Im gonna get some new 28" tall DR's.

tmoss · Jul 6, 2004

The 28" DRs will help you out. I'm also very interested in your catback results. Good luck!

willys1 · Jul 6, 2004

tmoss said:
The 28" DRs will help you out. I'm also very interested in your catback results. Good luck!

Thanks Tom I'LL let you know how I make out.By the way,my next day off is Monday.I will be sending you my old intake.Sorry for the delay.

tmoss · Jul 6, 2004

Be sure to put a note in it who it's from and that it is a return.

Went to track tonight,,need your help

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