Progress Thread 1989 GT Hatchback Restoration

[JasonRP]

Here's another question I have for you guys: What's going on with my rear hatch window? There is a pretty sizable gap between the the glass and the seal/trim.. Not sure what this is supposed to look like (can't remember!). Here's what mine looks like:

And a closer look:

I've seen windshield kits, and rear quarter window covers (I guess the trim comes made on to those quarter windows? Any other way to replace this but use the stock windows that say MUSTANG on them?)... but no rear window kits. Are these available?

The glass trim, and the door window trim/felts is of course blown out.... At some point I'd like to have the car painted- but there's a lot of other things that need done first. Therefore, should I hold off to do the window trim after paint? Or can it be done now without wasting effort? Sorry to ask such a newbie-ish question, but, never had a car painted before. Same question goes for the "Ford" oval logos front and back, and the 5.0 badges (which are OK for now, but the ovals are totally thrashed looking!) Guess I should wait on these?

 

[Davedacarpainter]

That gap isn't unusual. You can take the trime off and lightly bend it down a little in the corners. It's not too tough.

All the trim stuff would depend, for me, on how long it'll be before the body gets painted.

 

[Mstng93SSP]

Nothing wrong with stock. I run the stock Airbox in both of my foxbodies. I prefer it over an in the bay air filter.

 

[billison]

I also had a hot air intake on my car. Posted it on a local trade group wanting a stock set up. Someone gladly traded me.

For the low washer fluid light. It’s an oddball option in the 88-89 gt cars I think. It’s built into the washer fluid Reservoir . I’ve not been able to get mine to work properly.

 

[billison]

Also! Great work!

 

[JasonRP]

Well, it's been a while- have had lots of non-mustang business, as we all here have. Finally got back into the Mustang project today.. Sometimes, you just gotta do little stuff. For example, I masked off the rear window trim, and painted it back black (it was mostly black, but had lots of boo-boos.. Also, the car has wipers once again, now that I've re-painted the wiper arms, and put on new wiper blades. Is it normal for them to sit up this high? I can't remember!

Next up (hopefully!) is to fix the passenger side floorpan, and get this thing road ready!

 

[BlakeusMaximus]

Wipers are in their natural position.

 

[Mustang5L5]

Yeah, the sit high. I normall take my wipers off and store them in the hatch. I have rubber sleeves that fit over the splined shafts to clean up the look.

I don't drive in the rain so only time they go back on is inspection time

 

[JasonRP]

Ok, update.. Unfortunately, in this wonderful state of Maryland- apparently folks are so prosperous, it seems like NO ONE is willing to take on this work- none of the highly regarded body shops around here. They say they have new cars to fix, all day long, and don't want this thing messing up their shop I guess.. I know it's just business, but I am very frustrated by this!!!

I know I know- I should take a deep breath, and contemplate- if this is the worst of my problems, I got no room to be complaining! First world issue, eh?

So, I am not quite sure how to proceed. I can start calling fabrication shops (sounds expensive and timely).. Or, I can buy a Hobart handler, learn to do this stuff myself, do this work myself, and then sell the welder. Thoughts? My previous experience with a torch is limited to a cutting torch.....

 

[billison]

From what I’ve seen, many of the “body shops” are actually just collision shops and focus 99% on Insurance work. I’d look for restoration shops.

That said. I think lmr has a video on this job. Might be wrong

 

[billison]

I was wrong about lmr, but there are several how to videos on YouTube

 

[JasonRP]

I suspect maybe I have a level of ignorance when it comes to "body shops"... I felt like the ones that have turned me down could do the work, but are too busy riding the gravy train? But, perhaps as you say, I need to look for a restoration shop. I just think it sounds like it is three times more expensive? Just like when you take a BMW to the shop for a brake job, the estimate is like 3 times what the dude driving the old Mazda got- for essentially the same work? I could definately be wrong- and perhaps they're just specialized?

EDIT:
And I realize I'm being stupid about this- typical entitled right-now guy that I'm trying not to be, getting the best of me. I just got off the phone with a fabrication shop, that just got done doing floorpans in another foxbody. Looks like they'll get my $$$$ to fix my ride.

 

[General karthief]

Ask the 'fabrication ' shop to show you some of their work. Not the painted up pretty stuff, you want to see something in progress. Be patient, I've seen a few hack jobs that looked good all prettied up.
a guy here had a 70 mustang that was a 'rotisserie' restoration, when the car was side swiped one day sitting at a stop light the floor pan on the passenger side literally fell out.

 

[BlakeusMaximus]

I suspect maybe I have a level of ignorance when it comes to "body shops"... I felt like the ones that have turned me down could do the work, but are too busy riding the gravy train? But, perhaps as you say, I need to look for a restoration shop. I just think it sounds like it is three times more expensive? Just like when you take a BMW to the shop for a brake job, the estimate is like 3 times what the dude driving the old Mazda got- for essentially the same work? I could definately be wrong- and perhaps they're just specialized?

EDIT:
And I realize I'm being stupid about this- typical entitled right-now guy that I'm trying not to be, getting the best of me. I just got off the phone with a fabrication shop, that just got done doing floorpans in another foxbody. Looks like they'll get my $$$$ to fix my ride.

That’s why they are called “collision” shops. Collision work is all I’ve ever done, been in the industry since I was a kid and I’m pushing 40. Yes, we are driven by insurance company work. My shop in particular is a repair facility for Geico, Farmers, AAA, just to name the big ones, with tons of pressure of making our cycle times. I wouldn’t call it riding the gravy train at all. If I were to take in a job like that, it would just slow us down. Right now I couldn’t even guess when I would have something like that completed. There is a difference when you are doing collision work and when your doing restorations. That car needs a lot of work and if you don’t know what your are doing you need to find a restoration shop. You would be dealing with replacing structural parts, it has to be right.

 

[JasonRP]

@BlakeusMaximus - thanks man! Even though I'd worked in the dealerships back in the day, I never got too involved with the bodyshop (one of the shops I worked with had a body shop next door- the others always sent out their work).. My main observation of the body men was that they produced a ridiculous amount of sanding dust- that appeared to smell like bananas.. So, I really had no idea that they were specialized.

I'm realizing today that I stupidly was taking it personally, and the dude I talked to from the collision shop was really just trying to help me (he kept saying he didn't want my car to "die in their backlot" which at the time I couldn't understand what he meant).. Now I think he meant exactly what you are saying- that they don't usually do that kinda work, and therefore it would have to take a back seat to what pays their bills..

So, hope my earlier "gravy train" rant didn't offend anyone in the business! you guys honestly taught me something today about body shop specializations.

So, restoration or fab shop sounds like the right place for this indeed- because I honestly don't have the experience, and while I have surprised myself with things I've been able to pick up, this time I think I just want to pay someone to do it right the first time.

@General karthief - I'll take your suggestion, and go check out the shop and their work. What would you guys suggest as to how can I tell if they're legit? Look at their welds, and try to see if it matches my understanding of a "good penetration" weld? I know "stack of dimes" doesn't always mean everything.. I guess I will also look to see what kind of quality and attention to detail there appears to be going on.

 

[BlakeusMaximus]

@BlakeusMaximus - thanks man! Even though I'd worked in the dealerships back in the day, I never got too involved with the bodyshop (one of the shops I worked with had a body shop next door- the others always sent out their work).. So, I really had no idea that they were specialized. I stupidly was taking it personally, and the dude I talked to at the collision shop was just trying to help me (he kept saying he didn't want my car to "die in their backlot" and I didn't know what he meant).. Now I think he meant exactly what you are saying- that they don't usually do that kinda work, and therefore it would have to take a back seat to what pays their bills..

So, hope my earlier "gravy train" rant didn't offend anyone in the business!

So, restoration or fab shop sounds like the right place for this indeed- because I honestly don't have the experience, and while I have surprised myself with things I've been able to pick up, this time I think I just want to pay someone to do it right the first time.

@General karthief - I'll take your suggestion, and go check out the shop and their work. What would you guys suggest as to how can I tell if they're legit? Look at their welds, and try to see if it matches my understanding of a "good penetration" weld? I know "stack of dimes" doesn't always mean everything.. I guess I will also look to see what kind of quality and attention to detail there appears to be going on.

Not offended at all man. I hope you can get it done sooner than later and not have to spend too much money. But, it will be pricey, good luck!

 

[JasonRP]

Ok- a little update today.

So, I'd previously noticed, that none of my brake lights worked- yet the reverse lights worked, and the tail lights too. Also, the rear turn signals worked, but were white instead of yellow (this GT has LX tail lights)...

So after pouring over the brake light switch, the wires, etc. I finally check the bulbs- I mean, what are the chances that both brake lights, and both 3rd brake light bulbs were burned out? 100% in this case. Changing these all out (and one of the side tail marker lamps that was burned out) got the brake lights fully working. I got the right amber colored bulb for the turn signals- now all working.

I've been talking to the fabrication shop that's going to do my floorpans.. I was at first only going to replace the passenger floorpan which has through rust- but decided, for not much more $$$, I can replace the driver's side floorpan too- and why not if I'm going to all this trouble. AND, this lead to sub-frame connectors being purchased- because, I'm right there, and having welding done, I might as well while I'm here.

Question for you guys: all 4 tires are the wrong size. 3 of them (two rear, and the driver's side tire) are 205/65R15. The front passenger side is 205/60R15. I'm thinking I want to at least get the same series tire- if it is having the work done that I'm doing. My fear is, if it's not sitting evenly on all 4 rims, I'm possibly asking for a mis-aligned chassis when it is welded up? Or, does this matter?

ALSO: Anyone had a horn that won't press in, and therefore won't sound? I fixed this part (I think) by removing the vinyl cover and adding some sponge cushion pads I had there, then re-assembling. Looks like there are supposed to be some wires that connect the inner and outer contacts to the upper-right and lower contact, respectively? Grounding these out makes the horn slightly sound- then it stops, and I just hear the horn relay clicking... Maybe I need to replace the relay too. Man! This car had a LOT of issues!

Jason

 

[JasonRP]

Small update here, and some random thoughts...

The car has been at the fab shop for one week- they estimated 2-2.5 weeks, so, so far so good. Now I'm contemplating next moves once I get the car back.

There seems to be a ridiculous number of options for sound deadening material for the floor- some crazy expensive. I wonder what is close to what stock had? And, what (in you guys' experience) is the best bang-for-the-buck insulation, good performance, low price. Once I have this figured out, I'll be putting in a new carpet. God only knows what went down in that car in it's 29 year history, but looks to be various stains and things I do NOT want to know about! The AAC carpet for sale at LMR and CJPony look good, so, I'm excited about that part.

My passenger-side front seat looks pretty good. Driver's side however, has a tear in the vinyl part, and the right side of it leans back.. Is this common for the seats? Any fixing this? Call me crazy, 'cause I know it would be way cheaper probably to just by eBay "racing seats", but I want to fix the stock one- and want the fabric to be correct. The kits I've seen available to recover the seats sold at the usual suspects are nice, but don't appear authentic. Anyone had an upholstery shop re-do stock seats and it was 100%?

Finally, alternator question: I've got the stock (wimpy?) alternator. It works, and I hate to spend more $$$ if I don't have to, but I know it's not putting out big amps. However, this car has factory A/C delete, and manual windows and locks.. Anyone worked out a power budget on one of these cars? For example, clearly the alternator in the car now is enough for just driving as the car is- lights on or off, etc. BUT, if I add my phone charger (I'm guessing this is negligible amount of current draw), plus a decent, modern (no bigtime power amps) radio (with bluetooth, GPS, etc.), am I cutting things close?

And about the radio- I'd love to have a touchscreen or GPS/nav radio- this would be my only car with one, as I could add it for MUCH cheaper than the factory wanted for stock nav radios with my other cars (3k+ option! No thanks!) It's certainly not period though.. And, it would be kinda cool to find the stock radio to put in (even though according to my VIN, this car was factory radio delete too!). Anyone familiar with the stock radio unit- any chance there is an AUX-in channel on the back, so that I could integrate a phone or another music source?

I'm pretty sure this is the year/model correct factory radio:

...and not this one:

...however, I remember radios looking like the second one when I worked at a dealership in 1993-ish, and I also remember those radios having an option of a CD-disc changer.. So, I wonder if anyone here is familiar with either of these units (looks like they both mount the same way too- perhaps same harness on the back end?) enough to know if either has a CD or AUX input on the back, and support in the head unit so you can select a source other than AM/FM/cassette...

Jason

 

[Mustang5L5]

I'd put same size tires on the car as the subframe connectors should be welded in with car sitting level on its wheels.

A while back I took some readings of common things that use current on the car and was shocked to see how much was being drawn. Driving at night with all lights on was 20 amps alone, and the heater was another 20 amps. So right there was 40 amps.

Top radio was factory until 1992, but you can install the bottom more modern radio or the 1993 CD player (if you can find one) only the 1993 radios can control a changer but the Ford cd changers are rare as well. Some explorers and mark8s had them. I made a thread about putting the 93 system into An 87-92 car, but I've been getting the itch to just install a nice cheap double din with gps, Bluetooth, USB charging and app capability just to get with the times. I don't even own cds anymore.

 

[JasonRP]

Yup- somehow I missed an update- I used a multimeter, aligator clips, and wire to test the output of the horn relay at the horn from the horn wire connectors. Pressing the horn button (which works MUCH better now that I replaced the foam in the horn button) resulted in 12v. So, BOTH horns were dead. Advanced Autoparts had a low and high pitched horn, so I bought them, and replaced the horns themselves. Now I get a loud bi-tone horn when I press the switch. My wife is convinced I've lost my nuggets, happy that I can make my horn sound, but, it was work to get there!

Also, I replaced all 4 tires before sending the car to the fab shop- just so I was evenly sitting on all four wheels. Since I want to keep the 15" turbine rims, my choices for tires are a bit limited- I chose cheap this time: Fuzion 225/60R15 H-rated. While getting the tires put on, we noticed the brake lines for the rear drums were kaput, so these were replaced as well, and the brakes bled. WHAT A DIFFERENCE! I have pedal now!!!