Any differences in reliability between supercharger A and supercharger B?

[streetstang03]

ya, it looks good, but thats about it. not a big enough gain to fit the price tag. you're just paying for the Saleen name on it.

heatons

 

[Gearbanger 101]

ya, it looks good, but thats about it. not a big enough gain to fit the price tag. you're just paying for the Saleen name on it.

heatons

This it true and I agree that Saleen wants way too much money for their kits, but I think you're really paying more for the name when you buy one of them. I doubt when they set the prices of these kits, that it was meant to be a reflection on their value for the dollar performance in comparison to other blowers. it's not really the fault of the Eaton. That same blower is used after all in the '03-'04 Cobra's and owners are seeing 450+hp out of them when pushed hard, and even 500+ after porting.

 

[lgndracer]

There will of course be the argument from Twin Screw supporters to the effect that "if you want the best, you've got to pay for it" to justify the price difference.

Actually, if you compare apples to apples, they are pretty close in price. I looked for quite a while at all the S/C's before choosing one. I narrowed it down to a Mongoose kit, or a KB. If you bought a Mongoose kit for $3800, and added an intake and an intercooler, you would be very comparable if not higher than the KB. I chose the KB becuase I wanted the low end torque, as this is strictly a street car, and I think the twin screw/roots type S/C's look cooler.

 

[Gearbanger 101]

Actually, if you compare apples to apples, they are pretty close in price. I looked for quite a while at all the S/C's before choosing one. I narrowed it down to a Mongoose kit, or a KB. If you bought a Mongoose kit for $3800, and added an intake and an intercooler, you would be very comparable if not higher than the KB. I chose the KB becuase I wanted the low end torque, as this is strictly a street car, and I think the twin screw/roots type S/C's look cooler.

Well, if you bought it for the low end torque and the looks, that's one thing....but you wouldn't need to add an intake and an intercooler unless you planned on cranking up the boost on the Vortech and building up the bottom e end of the engine. The Centrifugals work just fine without an intercooler unless you plan on spinning them up past about 10psi. 10psi with a Vortech blower puts you right on par horsepower wise with your standard 9psi Kenne Bell. Adding the intake and cooler just opens up the door to bring things up to a whole other power level.

 

[tomustang]

atleast the saleen kit isn't as expencive as a rouch kit $7000+

 

[Seraphitia102]

Well, if you bought it for the low end torque and the looks, that's one thing....but you wouldn't need to add an intake and an intercooler unless you planned on cranking up the boost on the Vortech and building up the bottom e end of the engine. The Centrifugals work just fine without an intercooler unless you plan on spinning them up past about 10psi. 10psi with a Vortech blower puts you right on par horsepower wise with your standard 9psi Kenne Bell. Adding the intake and cooler just opens up the door to bring things up to a whole other power level.

to your knowledge, would adding a vortech power cool contribute to added durability rather than just more horsepower?

 

[Gearbanger 101]

to your knowledge, would adding a vortech power cool contribute to added durability rather than just more horsepower?

Yes and no. If you ran it with the recommended 8psi that MPH tunes the kit for, then there really isn't any advantage to adding the additional cooler. As long as the tune is conservative enough and the proper amount of timing is pulled and fuel is added, charge temperatures shouldn't be a problem. If you're going to push it into the 10psi+ zone, then sucking the heat away from the engine is going to help keep the short block alive in case you get a bad batch of fuel, or a really warm day or something. Either way, the additional intercooler won't do anything to aid in the durability of the blower itself. Since the cooler is bolted on downstream of the blower, the head unit itself is still going to spin just as hard and just as hot as it would if it wasn't on there. As a matter of fact, adding the intercooler to the system may raise the operation temperature of the blower itself a little, since it's now got the additional backpressure of blowing the charge through the cooler working against it. Often when adding a cooler to the mix, an already non-intercooled car will actually cost you about a pound of boost with the same size pulley, and you need to do a pulley swap (to a smaller one) in order to regain or surpass your previous levels. This holds true for all superchargers, not just the Vortech. The only way you wouldn’t have this problem, would be to cool with water/methanol. That way, there’s no after-cooler to blow through and create backpressure, just a fine mist of water.

 

[streetstang03]

to your knowledge, would adding a vortech power cool contribute to added durability rather than just more horsepower?

its all in the tune. just make sure you have a reputable tuner dyno tune your car and keep it under 420rwhp

are you more worried about the reliability of the blower or the engine??

 

[Seraphitia102]

its all in the tune. just make sure you have a reputable tuner dyno tune your car and keep it under 420rwhp

are you more worried about the reliability of the blower or the engine??

I am more worried about the reliability of the engine. But yes, I should be worried about the blower too... I know when I play/mod my car, I could probably expect lower engine life, but I'm wondering if I would send my engine to a "extremely" premature death if I added a blower.

 

[Seraphitia102]

Yes and no. If you ran it with the recommended 8psi that MPH tunes the kit for, then there really isn't any advantage to adding the additional cooler. As long as the tune is conservative enough and the proper amount of timing is pulled and fuel is added, charge temperatures shouldn't be a problem. If you're going to push it into the 10psi+ zone, then sucking the heat away from the engine is going to help keep the short block alive in case you get a bad batch of fuel, or a really warm day or something. Either way, the additional intercooler won't do anything to aid in the durability of the blower itself. Since the cooler is bolted on downstream of the blower, the head unit itself is still going to spin just as hard and just as hot as it would if it wasn't on there. As a matter of fact, adding the intercooler to the system may raise the operation temperature of the blower itself a little, since it's now got the additional backpressure of blowing the charge through the cooler working against it. Often when adding a cooler to the mix, an already non-intercooled car will actually cost you about a pound of boost with the same size pulley, and you need to do a pulley swap (to a smaller one) in order to regain or surpass your previous levels. This holds true for all superchargers, not just the Vortech. The only way you wouldn’t have this problem, would be to cool with water/methanol. That way, there’s no after-cooler to blow through and create backpressure, just a fine mist of water.

So if I were to add a non-intercooled Vortech SQ trim, would you know how much rwhp (estimate) my car would be? Also, ads in Mustang magazines say on adding a throttle body and plenum can add 8-30 rwhp. Would the 8hp gain be for an N/A engine and the 30hp be supercharged?

 

[Gearbanger 101]

So if I were to add a non-intercooled Vortech SQ trim, would you know how much rwhp (estimate) my car would be? Also, ads in Mustang magazines say on adding a throttle body and plenum can add 8-30 rwhp. Would the 8hp gain be for an N/A engine and the 30hp be supercharged?

I wouldn't worry about having a supercharger shortening your engine life dramatically. The only thing that's really going to affect how long your engine lasts is mileage and driving habits. The odd jaunt up to top end once and a while isn't going to cut it's lifespan in half.

With the Mongoose 8psi kit and your current mods, I would think you're car will make in the 350-360rwhp range. The more you open up things on the intake and exhaust ends, the more power you're going to make. As far as throttle body advertisements go, take them with a grain of salt. Expect to see about a 10hp gain with the throttle body when used in conjunction with the blower alone...and more if you add the elbow and on high flow mid-pipe to the exhaust. A 30hp gain would be an example of the most extreme combinations and hardly what your average Mustang enthusiast is going to see.


If you’re going to buy one, go with the 75mm unit and if you’re patient, wait until you can afford to buy the matching elbow at the same time.

 

[timeless2]

Great information, everyone. Keep it up!

 

[RedGTvert]

The Vortech is a tried and tested supercharger. Great reliability. Has good long term potential. Running in stock trim will get you in the 350-360rwhp area. If you are satisfied with this hp level, no need to add any sort of cooler. There are many people who can install in your area, no need to have anyone from MPH come and install.

 

[Seraphitia102]

Anyone know Chicane Sport Tuning? www.chicanesport.com

I do all my Mustang tuning there and Joe does a great job on all my tune ups. I believe he has worked at Saleen for 12 years...

 

[Seraphitia102]

The Vortech is a tried and tested supercharger. Great reliability. Has good long term potential. Running in stock trim will get you in the 350-360rwhp area. If you are satisfied with this hp level, no need to add any sort of cooler. There are many people who can install in your area, no need to have anyone from MPH come and install.

I'm fine with 350-360rwhp At least for now hahaha. I probably don't want to stretch anything so I can maintain it as a daily driver. I'm sure 360rwhp is just about as strong as a stock 03-04 Cobra right?

 

[Seraphitia102]

I wouldn't worry about having a supercharger shortening your engine life dramatically. The only thing that's really going to affect how long your engine lasts is mileage and driving habits. The odd jaunt up to top end once and a while isn't going to cut it's lifespan in half.

With the Mongoose 8psi kit and your current mods, I would think you're car will make in the 350-360rwhp range. The more you open up things on the intake and exhaust ends, the more power you're going to make. As far as throttle body advertisements go, take them with a grain of salt. Expect to see about a 10hp gain with the throttle body when used in conjunction with the blower alone...and more if you add the elbow and on high flow mid-pipe to the exhaust. A 30hp gain would be an example of the most extreme combinations and hardly what your average Mustang enthusiast is going to see.


If you’re going to buy one, go with the 75mm unit and if you’re patient, wait until you can afford to buy the matching elbow at the same time.

Thanks for all your great information. I take it that you do all your own mods?

 

[streetstang03]

i would expect anywhere from 350-380rwhp w/ the vortech and a good tune like i said though, i personally would go for the Paxton Novi 1000 mongoose kit from MPH though if you're looking for a centri blower from the research i've done over the years, it seems that the Novi has more potential than the Vortech S-trim for when you really want to turn the boost up.

good luck

 

[Seraphitia102]

i would expect anywhere from 350-380rwhp w/ the vortech and a good tune like i said though, i personally would go for the Paxton Novi 1000 mongoose kit from MPH though if you're looking for a centri blower from the research i've done over the years, it seems that the Novi has more potential than the Vortech S-trim for when you really want to turn the boost up.

good luck

I heard great things on Paxton. I just ended up looking at the Vortech SQ because of it being supposedly "super quiet." Is that really true? How much of the supercharger whine can you hear from the SQ trim?

What do you think of ATI ProCharger?

 

[DropTopPony]

Brand A and Brand B are the same company now aren't they? I like the Vortech kit for a street cruiser. Fairly quiet and reliable and still has some room to grow if you get forged internals in the future. The Novi is capable of much higher boost levels and i doubt you would ever need a blower that big. Also no need to order a MPH Mongoose kit since you deal with Chicane they can do your install and tune. You might even want to ask them if they can get you a kit and save some money since they would be doing the install and tune.

 

[Gearbanger 101]

Thanks for all your great information. I take it that you do all your own mods?

You are correct. My kit utilizes an Eaton M90, which actually isn't considered a large blower by any means. To make up for this, I've decided to over spin the blower as well as taken care of all of the mandatory intake and exhaust upgrades to take advantage of this and recapture some of the efficiency range I'll be losing by spinning it so hard. I ported my heads and blower intake myself at home and also beefed up my intercooling system to keep ACT's (Air charge temperatures) at bay, since Eatons have a tendency to get hot when you over spin them. I’m expecting to see in the 350-370rwhp range myself along with a healthy dose of bottom end torque to bet my big car moving. I could have gone with a bigger blower and made a lot more power and I still may if I get tired of this car and decide to get another Mustang. I’ll likely just buy a ’96-’98 GT afterwards and pull the already built short block out of my Cougar and swap it out with the stock one in the Mustang before I sell it. I’ll likely then sell my Allen Kit then too, to help pay for whatever blower I decide to go with next.

i personally would go for the Paxton Novi 1000 mongoose kit from MPH though if you're looking for a centri blower from the research i've done over the years, it seems that the Novi has more potential than the Vortech S-trim for when you really want to turn the boost up.

I'll assume you meant to say "Novi 2000" and not "1000", since I'm not aware of a Novi 1000 based Mongoose kit and that the Vortech S-Trim will move a fair bit more air and make more power than the 1000. The 2000 on the other hand, is a much more serious contender when compared to the S-Trim and will fulfill almost anyone’s power needs on the street....or at the track, for that matter.