Are Bilsteins REALLY worth it?

san~man · Sep 30, 2006

Dark Knight GT said:
Tell us more about your Bilstein + MM coil over combo. I'm getting ready to purchase me a set, and I'm just looking at what everyone's experience is with the Bisltein MM coil over combo.

I had the CO/Bils MM combo prior to what I have on now. The shop could never get the noise in the rear to go away. It was a loud noise that occurred when the rear end moved up/down or in an up/down angle. When we had my car up on the lift, you could see that the spring was grinding on the threaded spring mount and took off the last (top-most) 4 or so threads and ground them down flat.

When the shop took it off, one of the mechanics tried it on his car with the same result. Numerous calls to MM tech couldn't solve the problem. Now, many people had run the same setup with no problems so I can't tell you what the problem was. The shop replaced the CO setup with the H&R SS's, Bils, and panhard rod.

Now to the H&R SS/Bil combo. Between the two, there is IMO only a small difference in performance. The ride quality was the biggest improvement gain, IMO, in the using the CO setup. Felt a lot smoother and, for lack of a better term, "softer." Probably due to the lower spring rate and the moving of the shock/strut.

Is it worth the extra expense? IMO, no, unless you're going to see a lot of track/scca type duty. For a streetcar, they're not needed and you can get more parts for the price.

BennyBlown2v · Sep 30, 2006

Dark Knight GT said:
Tell us more about your Bilstein + MM coil over combo. I'm getting ready to purchase me a set, and I'm just looking at what everyone's experience is with the Bisltein MM coil over combo.

Bilstein HD's all around - 350lb springs up front, 200lb springs out back. I have the car sprung reasonably hard for a drag car, but I do alot of spirited daily driving and am a corner carver at heart. Also, when I add a torque arm next season It will be sprung relatively soft (better for drag). The setup is perfect now, the coilovers are easy to adjust, pretty quiet (spring noise every once and a while but nothing like san~man describes. One of the best things is being able to reduce the ammount of under/oversteer the car has by raising/lowing the front/rear independantly of one another. I have the car setup to be pretty neutral right now, but jack up the rear end in five minutes (literally) it's ready for the strip or road course!

EDIT: btw san~man, the spring rates are lower but the effective WHEEL rate is MUCH higher. The ride quality is better because of the design. Also, H&R Race springs are a better choice for handling over super sports - the SS springs are mainly cosmetic/daily driving. Which is fine if you have a street/daily driver car, of course

Dark Knight GT · Sep 30, 2006

BennyBlown2v said:
Bilstein HD's all around - 350lb springs up front, 200lb springs out back. I have the car sprung reasonably hard for a drag car, but I do alot of spirited daily driving and am a corner carver at heart. Also, when I add a torque arm next season It will be sprung relatively soft (better for drag). The setup is perfect now, the coilovers are easy to adjust, pretty quiet (spring noise every once and a while but nothing like san~man describes. One of the best things is being able to reduce the ammount of under/oversteer the car has by raising/lowing the front/rear independantly of one another. I have the car setup to be pretty neutral right now, but jack up the rear end in five minutes (literally) it's ready for the strip or road course!

EDIT: btw san~man, the spring rates are lower but the effective WHEEL rate is MUCH higher. The ride quality is better because of the design. Also, H&R Race springs are a better choice for handling over super sports - the SS springs are mainly cosmetic/daily driving. Which is fine if you have a street/daily driver car, of course

The spring rates you gave is what I was thinking of looking into getting. I mean the 350lbs up front and 200lbs in the rear. My car is a daily driver that gets about 7,000 miles a year. I too love to hug a corner. I'm also going to be getting the torque arm and probably a pan hard bar. I've already got the MM lower control arms, and I want to ditch the UPR upper control arms, as the control arms put added stress on the torque boxes, which aren't welded up as we speak, and the control arms don't do a good job of stabalizing the rear, at least not like what a pan hard bar should.

Glad to hear someone has had good results with the MM and Bilstein setup on all four posts. I too like the idea of adjustability, but I've been told that if you adjust the front end height, it throws off your alignment.

BennyBlown2v · Sep 30, 2006

Yeah if you adjust the front it will screw it up...also if you adjust the rear it will screw up the front a bit, so make sure you know where everything was BEFORE you go and start adjusting things haha.

GT12207 · Oct 1, 2006

Dark Knight GT said:
The spring rates you gave is what I was thinking of looking into getting. I mean the 350lbs up front and 200lbs in the rear. My car is a daily driver that gets about 7,000 miles a year. I too love to hug a corner. I'm also going to be getting the torque arm and probably a pan hard bar. I've already got the MM lower control arms, and I want to ditch the UPR upper control arms, as the control arms put added stress on the torque boxes, which aren't welded up as we speak, and the control arms don't do a good job of stabalizing the rear, at least not like what a pan hard bar should.

Glad to hear someone has had good results with the MM and Bilstein setup on all four posts. I too like the idea of adjustability, but I've been told that if you adjust the front end height, it throws off your alignment.

If you're going to get a Torque Arm (btw, best suspension mod, even better than coilovers), you might want to get at least 225 lbs in the rear, rather than 200. With 350 lbs in the front and a torque arm, the only reason to get 200 lbs for the rear is if you do a lot of DRAG RACING.

My setup is 325 lbs front, 225 lbs rears MM bilstein c/o.

Dark Knight GT · Oct 1, 2006

GT12207 said:
If you're going to get a Torque Arm (btw, best suspension mod, even better than coilovers), you might want to get at least 225 lbs in the rear, rather than 200. With 350 lbs in the front and a torque arm, the only reason to get 200 lbs for the rear is if you do a lot of DRAG RACING.

My setup is 325 lbs front, 225 lbs rears MM bilstein c/o.

Ahhh, so with the torque arm in the rear it's better to have stiffer springs ? I think I remember reading that some where, but wasn't sure. Thanks for the input, I appreciate it.

BTW, sorry if I seem like I hijacked the thread, but the subject was bilsteins, so since this is a related issue, I figured I would bring it up.

todd4566 · Oct 1, 2006

The Mach 1 struts sucked after I lowered my car. I hear Bilsteins are good but rough, so I bought Tokico HP's and I'm very satisfied.. and they're cheap too.

mity2 · Oct 1, 2006

Simply put, yes Its worth every penny IMO
I think my car ride smoother then it did with stock spring and stock shock

ALEX2028 · Oct 3, 2006

Does anyone know how the bilsteins compare to the edelbrock shocks. Do the bilsteins give a smooth ride with performance. I currently have the edelbrock shocks and the ride is really stiff and harsh when going over small bumps and pot holes on the road.

Dark Knight GT · Oct 3, 2006

ALEX2028 said:
Does anyone know how the bilsteins compare to the edelbrock shocks. Do the bilsteins give a smooth ride with performance. I currently have the edelbrock shocks and the ride is really stiff and harsh when going over small bumps and pot holes on the road.

Any aftermarket shock that is designed for performance (road handling) is going to be stiffer than the stock shocks. That could be the stiffness that you're experiencing with the Edelbrock shocks.

As for going over a bump, I'm not a "shock expert", but I'm pretty sure a lot of aftermarket shocks are designed to resist progressive centrifical force (forced compression in turns), but when hit all at once (like going over a bump), they will usually "bottom out".

I think Tomustang needs to comment, or perhaps Toralinth.

san~man · Oct 3, 2006

BennyBlown2v said:
Bilstein HD's all around - 350lb springs up front, 200lb springs out back. I have the car sprung reasonably hard for a drag car, but I do alot of spirited daily driving and am a corner carver at heart. Also, when I add a torque arm next season It will be sprung relatively soft (better for drag). The setup is perfect now, the coilovers are easy to adjust, pretty quiet (spring noise every once and a while but nothing like san~man describes. One of the best things is being able to reduce the ammount of under/oversteer the car has by raising/lowing the front/rear independantly of one another. I have the car setup to be pretty neutral right now, but jack up the rear end in five minutes (literally) it's ready for the strip or road course!

EDIT: btw san~man, the spring rates are lower but the effective WHEEL rate is MUCH higher. The ride quality is better because of the design. Also, H&R Race springs are a better choice for handling over super sports - the SS springs are mainly cosmetic/daily driving. Which is fine if you have a street/daily driver car, of course

Explain how raising or lowering the car changes the amount of under/oversteer...

Most use other methods.

Stang|ess · Oct 5, 2006

san~man said:
Explain how raising or lowering the car changes the amount of under/oversteer...

Most use other methods.

A source told me that you're supposed to either use different tires, sway bars, or the camber to achieve different oversteer/understeer to suit your needs

lex8109 · Oct 10, 2006

san~man said:
Must depend on the batch. I've seen some that say "Monroe" on them.

Either way, the Bilsteins will easily outhandle the Tokico's. I know, I've had both and the difference is "Night and day."

Which Tokico's did you have? The HP?

san~man · Oct 10, 2006

lex8109 said:
Which Tokico's did you have? The HP?

I had the OEM Bullitt's, which are Tokico HP's revalved to Ford's specs.

todd4566 · Oct 10, 2006

san~man said:
I had the OEM Bullitt's, which are Tokico HP's revalved to Ford's specs.

And their valving is terrible, in comparison (corner-carving, that is). I had Bullitt struts on my GT, and the stock Tokico's all around on the Mach; the difference was night & day when I switched to the blue HP's.

Are Bilsteins REALLY worth it?

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