Bullitt Suspension Build Expectation

[ace305]

I am looking to build a cornering machine for nice windy roads.

Build list

all new parts

slotted drilled rotors
KYB 235050 struts
Monroe Matic Plus shocks
Eibach Sport Line Springs
SR Performance Front & Rear Sway Bars and end links front and rear
BMR upper and lower controls arms with poly bushings
Front controls arms with new bushings and ball joints
Steeda Offset Steering Rack Bushings

Still have stock Subframes.

I am not going to do a K member. what else should I do for the best weekend worrier road handler?

panhard?
strut tower?
CC plates?

are my shocks and struts the weak link?

thanks

 

[Neuron]

Strut tower brace and heavy duty welded in sub frame connectors, CC Plates for sure.

 

[rancorkeeper]

The stock subframes are a weaker link than the shocks - they aren't welded. I agree with the previous poster as well; get a strut tower brace.

 

[squeak93]

4 bolt cc plates and weld in sub frames. Full length with seat braces.

Rear shock tower brace along with the front strut brace.

If you want to get real nasty do a rear panhard bar setup.

 

[ace305]

Thanks for the info. Is the rear panhard a big upgrade?

 

[rancorkeeper]

Is the rear panhard a big upgrade?

I've always thought they were kind of pointless on an SN95 because of the upper control arm design. I'm not sure it's much of an upgrade, but others may disagree.

 

[squeak93]

In the drag race world yes it is useless. In the twisty world it's a big help to keep the suspension centered and more predictable.

http://www.maximummotorsports.com/tech_rear_susp_panhard.aspx

Tons of info about them out there. But it all depends on what your goals are.

 

[rancorkeeper]

In the drag race world yes it is useless. In the twisty world it's a big help to keep the suspension centered and more predictable.

Great link. I'd be interested to see the writer of the article debate a Ford engineer as to how their panhard bar doesn't actually misalign the roll center that was engineered into the car with the factory four link uca design. From what I've heard during my autocrossing days, a lot of SN95 drivers don't bother with a panhard on our cars because it doesn't really help, or they think it's counterproductive because it binds up by adding a second lateral suspension component that fights the factory design. A common belief was polyurethane control arm bushings were a better upgrade.

However, I never put a bar on my Bullitt, so I can't say it did better or worse with one installed. It's certainly possible; I'm just passing along what I heard, specific to our vehicle.

 

[squeak93]

I've read both ways as well. I think the auto x guys get away with a LOT more due to the speeds they enter curves etc. Road Racers tend to make a lot more power and enter corners at a much higher rate of speed which further complicates the issues addressed in the article.

 

[ace305]

awesome thanks yall. I have CC plates and rear shock tower support coming now.

 

[Mattstang04]

If you install a panhard bar and are worried about the adverse effects of binding, you can throw a torque arm on as well. Then you can delete the two upper control arms and have effectively changed to a 3 link suspension. Handle like the 3rd and 4th gen F bodies or the S197 cars. They really do handle better than our four links, anyway. Better in a straight line and in the twisties.

Unfortunately our 4 link setup does allow that back axle to shift side to side. I've never tracked either of my new edge cars but the old GT did some aggressive driving. That car had C springs, subframes, strut tower brace, MM lowers, KYB adjustables on all 4 corners, Eibach sway bars and BFG kdw2 tires. On an on/off ramp with a long sweeping turn you could feel the car's body shift over on the axle. It was kind of unnerving.

 

[ace305]

awesome info here. Thank you. I have learned allot here so far

 

[ace305]

are Koni Orange better than stock? I have new KYB 235050 and think I should go better.

this is my parts to start tomorrow. I have Bump Steer kit on order now.

 

[Dark04GT]

+1 to full length subframe connectors.

Panhard bar is definately worth it - eliminating the side to side slop definately keeps the rear end much more predictable on turns.

The factory even went with a panhard bar setup starting in 05’ - way better (several years ago there was a stock coyote vs M3 comparrison - pretty impressive for the stock setup).

I’d add a solid steering shaft to your list. Easy to install and plus the rack bushings should make your steering awesome.

Hope you have some sticky tires to enjoy your suspension fun.

 

[ace305]

got the rear done. The BMR upper and lower control arms have grease fittings. I was unable to grease them yet since I did not have the correct grease. I drove the car about two miles and I hear all kinda noises. I hope its to due to no grease yet.

 

[squeak93]

What kind of noises?

 

[rancorkeeper]

The factory even went with a panhard bar setup starting in 05’ - way better .

That's because the S197 is a three link system, unlike the SN95 which is a four link (technically, it's a triangulated four link). I think most automotive engineers would say a panhard bar is a necessity with a three link, but you'll find some disagreement on whether it helps a four link with angled upper control arms.

 

[ace305]

What kind of noises?

ok I have everything greased up and the squeaking is gone but I have a clunk sound going over bumps. i rechecked everything for torque. I installed new swaybar, upper and lower control arms, poly spring bushings and rear shock tower brace. I already had new shocks and springs on the car. I cant seem to find this clunk noise. seems like it happens on very fast bumps. I tried pushing on the rear to see if I could re create it but no go. It must be a shock. Could installing the strut bar create an issue with the shock?

the shocks are new but not performance. I have a whole set of Koni Orange in the mail to me.

 

[Dark04GT]

That's because the S197 is a three link system, unlike the SN95 which is a four link (technically, it's a triangulated four link). I think most automotive engineers would say a panhard bar is a necessity with a three link, but you'll find some disagreement on whether it helps a four link with angled upper control arms.

I agree - Straight line and street driving the 4 link does very well for most people. MM measures out up to 2” of lateral movement in the rear suspension because of those angled upper arms (this is when you are driving it hard / maxing suspension travel). Most people aren’t pushing it that hard and that lateral movement is acceptable.

My panhard definitely tightened up the rear end - but my preference is a mustang tailored towards turning left and right (road racing and autocross). You can definitely tell with spirited driving that the rear end is much more predictable with the pan hard. The three link in the S197 is a better rear design (i’m Jealous). Unfortunately we have to add several pieces to create a three link or go the watts route. If the OP is interested in getting the most out of his suspension turning left and right - these are small gains but definitely the panhard is a great option to make you faster in the twists.

 

[ace305]

ok so I think I found the problem. The new sway bar is hitting the exhaust ever so slightly. you can see the paint rubbing off the bar. I have Borla Stinger cat back. What can I do? take off the pipe and beat it flat?