Car starts when it wants

[savegoodautonfg]

My car has been running and starting on every try except for when my battery was dead 2 days ago. now tonight it ran fine all day and i came home then went out a lil while later and when i went to start it it wouldnt start. no crank or anything. almost like their was no engine in the car at all.

popped the hood, looked to see if anything obvious, nothing so just for the hell of it i tried to start it again and it started. turned it off tried again 2 times and it started both times.

Then i left my friends house 20 mins later and it did the same thing again.waited a few min after looking under the hood again and tried to start it and it didnt so i tried to roll start it and it worked on the 3rd try.

any ideas?

 

[Fett]

Next time the car won't start, use a rubber handle screw driver and bypass the starter solenoid. Turn the key on and hold the clutch in with the e-brake on and the car OUT of gear, have someone take the screw driver and touch across the two posts on the starter solenoid and see if the car cranks. If it does, then you need to replace the solenoid.

Another thing to try FIRST is, when the car won't start tap the solenoid and then try again. When solenoids start to go bad, they can get stuck and not allow power to the starter. Tapping it sometimes releases it and allows the car to start. Bypassing it with a screw driver, or other metal object with a rubber handle will put juice straight to the starter.

That way you can rule out the solenoid as a problem.

 

[savegoodautonfg]

Thanks for quick reply. I never had to deal with starter stuff where is the starter solenoid?

 

[savegoodautonfg]

oh i figured out where it is forget it.

so tommorow morning anything else i should check if thats not it?

 

[HISSIN50]

An alternative is [when it acts up] to simply see if the little wire on the solenoid shows 12 volts while cranking.

I would also check your battery connections and solenoid connections. Clean and/or snug them up.

Good luck.

 

[bullitstang1313]

I would definately check your battery connections, especially your ground. I've seen people replace all kinds of parts when it was a ground that was loose and occasionally didn't make any connection.

 

[savegoodautonfg]

Ground is good thanks for input tho. going outside right now to check a few other things.

 

[savegoodautonfg]

I think it was the starter solenoid. went to auto pro this store by my house my dad is the manager. got a new KEM one for $4.85. cant beat that.

 

[jrichker]

No Crank checklist for 5.0 Mustangs

Since some of the tests will bypass the safety interlocks, make sure that the car is in neutral and the parking brake is set. Becoming a pancake isn’t part of the repair process…

Check battery, terminal connections, ground, starter relay switch (also known as solenoid) and starter in that order. The clamp on with 2 bolts battery terminal ends are a know problem causer.

A voltmeter is handy if you are familiar with how to use it to find bad connections. Measure the voltage drop across a connection while trying to start the car: more than .5 volts across a connection indicates a problem.
See http://www.fluke.com/application_notes/automotive/circuit.asp?AGID=1&SID=103 for help for help troubleshooting voltage drops across grounds.

1.) Will the car start if it is jumped? Then clean battery terminals and check battery.

2.) Check the battery to engine block ground, and the ground behind the engine to the firewall.

3.) Jump the big terminals on the starter relay next to the battery with a screwdriver - watch out for the sparks! If the engine cranks, the starter and power wiring is good. The starter relay is also known as a starter solenoid.

4.) Then pull the small push on connector (small red/blue wire) off the starter solenoid (Looks like it is stuck on a screw). Then jump between the screw and the terminal that is connected to the battery. If it starts, the relay is good and your problem is in the rest of the circuit.

5.) Remember to check the ignition switch, neutral safety switch on auto trans and the clutch safety switch on manual trans cars. If they are good, then you have wiring problems.
Typical start circuit...
Diagram courtesy of Tmoss & Stang&2birds

See http://www.autozone.com/images/cds/gif/large/0900823d80195963.gif for 88-90 year cars
See http://www.autozone.com/images/cds/gif/large/0900823d80195964.gif for 91-93 year cars.
See http://www.autozone.com/servlet/UiB..._us/0900823d/80/1d/db/3c/0900823d801ddb3c.jsp for 94-95 model cars.

6.) The starter may be hung, loosen up the bolts that hold it on, and give it a good whack with a big hammer. Tighten up the bolts and try again.

7.) If that doesn't work, use a jumper cable from the positive lead on the battery direct to the starter post where the big wire from the relay connects. If it cranks then, it is the power wire from the relay gone bad. This will be hard to do, since there isn't much room to do it.

8.) Pull the starter and take it to Autozone or Pep Boys and have them test it. Starter fails test, then replace it. If you got this far, the starter is probably bad.

 

[savegoodautonfg]

Well just put the new starter solenoid on and tried to start. it did'nt start so i said maybe the new solenoid is bad.. put the old one back in did'nt start. so switched it back to the new one and it starts. i did'nt do anything other then that. this is really weird. the stuff that jritcher posted seems helpful but before i go thru all that. anyone have any other opinions first?

 

[savegoodautonfg]

Also to add, when it did'nt start i tried tapping the starter solenoid and it did'nt do anything and when i tried to turn the key to start the engine the little red wire hissin told me to check did'nt show any volts. but when the car did start the volts showed 9.?? when it was cranking. so i replaced the solenoid back to the old one while it was'nt starting and it didnt do anything so i know the starter solenoid is good then.

 

[savegoodautonfg]

Also when you said to put the screwdriver across the two post you were talking about laying a screwdriver across these 2 posts right?

with nothing else connected to the starter relay right?

if i did it right like i said above, when the car would'nt start i tried that and it didnt start then either.

so it seems like i ruled out the starter solenoid being the problem?

all battery connections and starter relay connection look fine.

 

[HISSIN50]

Also to add, when it did'nt start i tried tapping the starter solenoid and it did'nt do anything and when i tried to turn the key to start the engine the little red wire hissin told me to check did'nt show any volts. but when the car did start the volts showed 9.?? when it was cranking. so i replaced the solenoid back to the old one while it was'nt starting and it didnt do anything so i know the starter solenoid is good then.

If this is so, that suggests an issue with the trigger wiring leading to the solenoid. With intermittant cranking signals, the clutch switch's adjustment is the place to check first IMHO.

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If you could not get it to start with jumping across those two big lugs (per the post above this one. I forgot to multiquote), the battery, battery cables, solenoid connections, motor grounds, etc are also likely the issue. The screwdriver across the big lugs test basically connects the battery to the starter.

 

[savegoodautonfg]

If this is so, that suggests an issue with the trigger wiring leading to the solenoid. With intermittant cranking signals, the clutch switch's adjustment is the place to check first IMHO.

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If you could not get it to start with jumping across those two big lugs (per the post above this one. I forgot to multiquote), the battery, battery cables, solenoid connections, motor grounds, etc are also likely the issue. The screwdriver across the big lugs test basically connects the battery to the starter.

The wires leading to the solenoid is the battery positive terminal and what else? So i could check those wires cause thats what you saying it should be. right?

The clutch safety switch is what your talking about? the gray connection under the dash with the two wires?

 

[Roland69]

next time try the batery term's...My car did this alot and I would have to play with the groubd connection on the batery....I ended up tightening the terminals

 

[HISSIN50]

The wires leading to the solenoid is the battery positive terminal and what else? So i could check those wires cause thats what you saying it should be. right?

The clutch safety switch is what your talking about? the gray connection under the dash with the two wires?

YOu would seem to have two issues occurring. The first is that sometimes your starter interlock circuit isn't receiving 12 volts while cranking. This is one issue. I'd trace the starter interlock circuit here.

You noted that jumping the large lugs on the solenoid doesnt always make the car crank. That's a separate issue.
Check the battery terminal connections, the solenoid connections, the cables leaving the battery, the grounds and consider the battery itself.

 

[tunedin302]

Check the obvious first - make sure your clutch pedal is engaging the safety switch.