Engine Rebuild?

A5literMan said:

I'm not trying to start a debate or anything but even your statement makes my point. They are an inferior product designed for a non roller cam. Umm isn't be going to run a roller cam? I will repeat my previous statement. E streets suck and would not be my recommendation

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well again, e streets do not "suck" . . one of his comments suggested to me that he no longer, wants a ton of hp because he then needs to spend more money on the trans so now he seems to have a tight budget and has lowered his hp desires . . you can also run a small roller on a e street heads with the stock springs . . if he is on a budget, he can run a non roller cam . . the more options a person knows about, the more informed their decision can be.

B.erazo712 said:

I I think i might just go with a 306, instead of a 331 stroker, because it just keeps adding up. And would these be the necessary mods for the AOD?

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barnett468 said:

well again, e streets do nots "suckpone"" of his comments suggested to me that he no longer, wants a ton of hp because he then needs to spend more money on the trans so now he seems to have a tight budget and has lowered his hp desires . .i havenoideaifheis goingtoruns ro llerc am i a

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I think the problem is w the springs that they come with. I think they're more for a flat tappet cam

90lxwhite said:

I think the problem is w the springs that they come with. I think they're more for a flat tappet cam

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well its complicated . . the springs dont care if its a roller or not . . you simply need the right springs for the right cam and yes the springs in those heads are not for big cams and high rpms . . i think they coil bind after .560 lift.

if you talk to the tech supervisor at eddy he will tell you that you certainly can run a roller but it will need to be a small one, but the heads are intentionally designed to be entry level and are advertised as such, ergo the budget springs . . not everyone wants a 400 hp 7000 rpm 302.

you get US made, ALUMINUM, heads, that OUTFLOW stockers by a decent margin . . they are obviously LIGHTER than iron so you save weight, they look more COOL than iron, you can run MORE COMPRESSION with them than iron . . all this for ONLY around $950.00 . . whats not to like?

barnett468 said:

well its complicated . . the springs dont care if its a roller or not . . you simply need the right springs for the right cam and yes the springs in those heads are not for big cams and high rpms . . i think they coil bind after .560 lift.

if you talk to the tech supervisor at eddy he will tell you that you certainly can run a roller but it will need to be a small one, but the heads are intentionally designed to be entry level and are advertised as such, ergo the budget springs . . not everyone wants a 400 hp 7000 rpm 302.

you get US made, ALUMINUM, heads, that OUTFLOW stockers by a decent margin . . they are obviously LIGHTER than iron so you save weight, they look more COOL than iron, you can run MORE COMPRESSION with them than iron . . all this for ONLY around $950.00 . . whats not to like?

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Barney, E street heads suck. Period. Ask your buddy Ed Curtis or Woody. For another $100 you can get TFS170's that will blow those away and have hardware that isn't garbage.. And yeah i've called Edelbrock tech and talked to them. They told me the springs on those heads are marginal past .500 lift . Quick primer on these heads- you remember the Corral, right?

WARNING: Edelbrock E-Street Heads - Ford Mustang Forums : Corral.net Mustang Forum

barnett468 said:

the stall is dependent on the gear ratio and operating range of the engine . . a 3000 stall would basically be for an engine that spun 7000 rpm.

the oad is simple for your app.

red alto bands and clutches or even bosch

shift kit

ribbed high volume aluminum trans pans are nice and wont leak

competition servo

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3000 stall is only for an engine that pulls 7000 rpm? Where did you get that from.. Things like weight of the car, tire size, gear ratio, cam shaft. power adder or n/a and powerband all play into proper converter selection. Furthermore, different companys have different stall speeds.

mikestang63 said:

3000 stall is only for an engine that pulls 7000 rpm? Where did you get that from.. Things like weight of the car, tire size, gear ratio, cam shaft. power adder or n/a and powerband all play into proper converter selection. Furthermore, different companys have different stall speeds.

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I've always been under the impression that you matched your stall to your cam and intake combo. I.e.... power comes in at 2000 rpm, 2000-2500 rpm stall. It wont let your rpms drop below your power band when you shift.

mikestang63 said:

3000 stall is only for an engine that pulls 7000 rpm? Where did you get that from.. Things like weight of the car, tire size, gear ratio, cam shaft. power adder or n/a and powerband all play into proper converter selection. Furthermore, different companys have different stall speeds.

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it's just a rough general statement . . he does not need a 3000 rpm stall on a street car with a 262 duration cam . . an engine that spins to 7000 needs a 3000 stall way moer than one that spins to 5500 because the 7000 rpm one wont have nearly as much power in the lower rpm range.

Boosted92LX said:

I've always been under the impression that you matched your stall to your cam and intake combo. I.e.... power comes in at 2000 rpm, 2000-2500 rpm stall. It wont let your rpms drop below your power band when you shift.

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thats sort of a decent, general rule of thumb imo . . also, the numerically higher your gears are, the lower the stall rpm you can get away with . . also, a stall converter does lock up before the flash or peak stall rating when the load is light like cruising at an even speed on level ground.

mikestang63 said:

Barney, E street heads suck. Period. Ask your buddy Ed Curtis or Woody. For another $100 you can get TFS170's that will blow those away and have hardware that isn't garbage.. And yeah i've called Edelbrock tech and talked to them. They told me the springs on those heads are marginal past .500 lift . Quick primer on these heads- you remember the Corral, right?

WARNING: Edelbrock E-Street Heads - Ford Mustang Forums : Corral.net Mustang Forum

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thats hilarious because eddie used to sell e street heads and he has defended them on the corral implying that they DO NOT SUCK and they ARE good for their intended purpose, however, since he no longer sells them, he probably now says they suck and tells people they should buy the other heads he currently sells, lol.

post 27 from good ol' eddie in the thread you posted...hmmm?

"In terms of Edelbrock misleading people, they are not. They are putting together a cylinder head package based strictly by price point. Nothing wrong with that as long as you, the consumer, is smart enough to know they are purchasing a basic cylinder head package and have to match the rest of the peripherals to the engine."

you are beatin the wrong horse and trying to make a mountain out of a mole hill for some reason because i have already stated that the tfs heads are better.

also, just where can you but tfs 170 heads for just $100.00 more than e streets?

From woody in post 6.

"I dont know what people expect for 800 dollars retail."


From "eddie" in post 27.

"To the whiners:

...don't bi_ch-out Edelbrock..."

I really don't want to say much more because it's not my intention to troll or crap all over this forum. I hate it when others do. But I DO NOT agree about these heads. TFS heads can be bought for about 1200$ brand new or wait until summit throws there annual sale and save another 10%. So yeah they're more expensive but if you run ANY descent cam you need better springs AND they still won't flow much. Why would someone spend 950$ and be completely stuck with the limited head? I understand Barney's point about budget and these being a budget head but ...no f'ing way I'd buy them...even on a budget. I'd save money in other areas. Each there own.

barnett468 said:

From "eddie" in post 27.

"To the whiners:

...don't bi_ch-out Edelbrock..."

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Funny how you reference Ed's post but selectively edit out the key parts.

"They are putting together a cylinder head package based strictly by price point. Nothing wrong with that as long as you, the consumer, is smart enough to know they are purchasing a basic cylinder head package and have to match the rest of the peripherals to the engine.

Other manufacturers such as Brodix and AFR put in their instructions, the information you need on valvetrain as well as a warning to make sure the springs match the camshaft. This is nothing new so don't bitch-out Edelbrock for doing this.

I remember the same complaints when Edelbrock came out with the new series of heads that contained all the latest valvetrain features and people complained about the "high" price. They just can't win.

It's simple, ya gotta pay to play."

Or this post by Ed later in the thread

"They would have worked just fine if he "bolted them on" to a stock engine. However, by using a non-stock camshaft, a different spring is required. "

Or this post by Ed later in the thread

"Ask "Tech Dave" why the Edelbrock literature regarding the SBF "E-street" heads, notes they did their dyno testing with their own amshaft #2122 - a flat tappet hydraulic camshaft.

Those springs are not for any aftermarket hydraulic roller camshaft. Stock - maybe - but anything with some nuts is going to fail.

Things that make you go - hmmmmm..."

You must not have read these posts either Barney.

"The tech was very helpful. But he stated that the ad for the E-Street heads are very deceiving. It says they can handle a .550 lift. However, he said that anything over .500 would be overkill for the valvetrain. He even said a stock cam might be a bit too aggressive. As for the rpm limits...he said that the ad says the heads are good for up to 5500rpm....and nothing more. 6000rpm....forget about it. Let's be realistic, a stock headed 5.0 can motor to 6000rpm without valvetrain issues. He told me that the E-Street heads main purpose was to compete with the Chinese knock-offs(which have even worse valvetrain). He was trying to get the word out that these heads really are very deceiving and that if you want a mild cylinder head, then the Performers would be the way to go. "

Or this post

"Bought my estreets and changed the springs to PAC to match my fti cam. Then 1500 miles later broke a rocker stud while cruising to work. Now have arp studs I guess valves are next. If I had known I would have spent the money to get a higher quality head I guess you live and learn."

Those heads are junk. Put them on YOUR car. Don't tell newbs to put them on their car. And you can normally pick up TFS 170's for around 1050-1100 with dscount codes from several vendors.

i didn't "selectively" edit out anyting for any ulterior motive as it seems to me you are attempting to imply . . i simply didn't see a need to waste space on this persons thread by making a full page post like you did . . eddie used to sell the e street heads . . can't deny it . . you are STILL trying to make a mountain out of a mole hill and are doing exactly what you said you don't like other people doing . . is there an end to this?

the tfs heads cost $250.00 more than e streets on average, and for that $250.00 more, you get a much better head . . i already stated something similar to this previously . . this being said, eddy has sold around 10 zillion of those heads so it is blatantly obvious that they are popular for what ever reason . . to deny this fact simply makes no sense . . as i said, not everyone wants to spin their engine over 5500 or 6000 rpm and have 2,000 rear wheel hp.

also, the statement from eddie below is simply wrong . . just because eddie says its so doesn't make it so, lol. and i know for a fact that there are many people running cams that are bigger than "stock" with the stock springs on these heads and have never had a problem.

""They would have worked just fine if he "bolted them on" to a stock engine. However, by using a non-stock camshaft, a different spring is required. "

A5literMan said:

I really don't want to say much more because it's not my intention to troll or crap all over this forum. I hate it when others do. But I DO NOT agree about these heads. TFS heads can be bought for about 1200$ brand new or wait until summit throws there annual sale and save another 10%. So yeah they're more expensive but if you run ANY descent cam you need better springs AND they still won't flow much. Why would someone spend 950$ and be completely stuck with the limited head? I understand Barney's point about budget and these being a budget head but ...no f'ing way I'd buy them...even on a budget. I'd save money in other areas. Each there own.

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I agree on all points. The E streets aren't cheap enough for the gamble, and yall calm down. This dude is trying to get his ducks in a row and the arguing might lead him a stray.

Sometimes mommy and daddy disagree :shutup:but we still love you.

A5literMan said:

Sometimes mommy and daddy disagree :shutup:but we still love you.

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If the E streets were say $500 I might give em a try and hope for the best. But definatly not for nearly a grand.

i would 0 deck the block.

i would run around 9.7 - 10.0 static compression.

balance the engine.

if the rubber on your crank damper looks wasted or if you are going to flog the engine i would get a new one . . pioneer or durabond oem type or sfi rated.

make sure your ignition timing is optimized for your engine.

i would run at least 3.25 rear gears with that cam
.

.
i would buy .020" over pistons if mahle makes them.