Ethanol blended fuel effects?

Skidawg · Mar 3, 2006

With my state's legislature mulling over mandating a 10% ehtanol blended fuel, I was curious to see if anyone knew any effects to the engine?

I currently live in a 10% ethanol area (mandated my the Feds), but have access to counties not under this requirement. When I get the chance, I take the short drive to fill up with the 100% fuel. If this mandate passes, I won't have this option.

Local "urban legends" have this blended fuel scouring the interior of fuel tanks and not buring correctly because the engines aren't really designed for this. A lot of GM owners of 90's models are claiming to be blowing through fuel injectors left and right.

I have a pretty good grasp on the differences between the fuels. I'm against such a mandate, and my state rep has heard my opposition. The vote is coming very soon and just might pass.

I'm just curious if any of you techies have any insight to the differences and effects to the engine...?

Thanks!

stangGT97 · Mar 3, 2006

Well, from personal experience - my 97 stang runs like CRAP with 10% ethanol. My gas mileage decreased significantly, and i was getting some pinging with 87 octane, which has never ever happened to me before. BTW, this fuel came from Shell... 10% ethanol my ass

other people may have different experiences though, just stating what happened to me

Green00GT · Mar 3, 2006

stangGT97 said:
Well, from personal experience - my 97 stang runs like CRAP with 10% ethanol. My gas mileage decreased significantly, and i was getting some pinging with 87 octane, which has never ever happened to me before. BTW, this fuel came from Shell... 10% ethanol my ass

other people may have different experiences though, just stating what happened to me

I live in Iowa so ethenol is a BIG deal here. Actually the 10% ethnol blend is 89 or 89.5 octane (depends where you go) and is usually $.10 cheaper per gallon than 87. The state has an incentive on ethenol that is why it is cheaper. Anyway, I run 10% ethenol in everything I own (autos, motorcycle, snowblower, lawn mower) and have never had a problem that was fuel related.
I've never seen 85 octane that was an ethenol blend. Ethenol increases the octane level. E85 is 105 octane. You do get less milage from E85 though because ethenol has less energy than gas based on volume. However, I get 24 mpg in my Mustang on the highway running 10% ethenol so I don't think it hurts my milage. If E85 is available in your area DON'T put it in your Mustang or you will have problems.

I think the ethenol myths have their roots in the early 80's when gasahol did have problems. The blend is different now than it was back then so I wouldn't worry about ethenol.

Disturbed One · Mar 3, 2006

Green00GT said:
I live in Iowa so ethenol is a BIG deal here. Actually the 10% ethnol blend is 89 or 89.5 octane (depends where you go) and is usually $.10 cheaper per gallon than 87. The state has an incentive on ethenol that is why it is cheaper. Anyway, I run 10% ethenol in everything I own (autos, motorcycle, snowblower, lawn mower) and have never had a problem that was fuel related.
I've never seen 85 octane that was an ethenol blend. Ethenol increases the octane level. E85 is 105 octane. You do get less milage from E85 though because ethenol has less energy than gas based on volume. However, I get 24 mpg in my Mustang on the highway running 10% ethenol so I don't think it hurts my milage. If E85 is available in your area DON'T put it in your Mustang or you will have problems.

I think the ethenol myths have their roots in the early 80's when gasahol did have problems. The blend is different now than it was back then so I wouldn't worry about ethenol.

I live in Iowa also, bout a 30 min drive from Green00Gt if he's in Boone. All my vehicles I've owned run on 89 octane with ethanol. Never had a problem with any of them. On the one long trip I've taken with the mustang I averaged around 22.5-23 mpg. It doesn't affect the car I feel at all. Just like stated above do not put in straight E85 or say bye bye motor.

Justin03GT · Mar 3, 2006

i remember the super stallion concept back in 97, was designed to run on 93 or e85 and would make an extra 45hp when on the e85..

DropTopPony · Mar 3, 2006

I welcome the use of ethanol, If e-85 was available in my area i would find out what i needed to convert and do it. More octane = more boost Screw the oil companies...Imagine the revitalization of the mid west farmers if we could use Corn as the major ingredient in our fuels.

SamMan · Mar 3, 2006

How would e85 at 105 octane be different than say race fuel at 105+ octane?

Crzyhrse · Mar 3, 2006

Yep, same as the other Iowa corn heads. I grew up in Iowa and used it in all my vehicles I owned. Not all the time, but a good amount of the time. Never had any problems with it. When I had my '93 GT I switched to the higher grade 91 because it was pretty modified.

billfisher · Mar 3, 2006

10 percent without octane improvement loses 5% economy and mileage.

it takes 50% more alchohol for the same BTU output as gasoline. it carries it's own oxygen(c6h12o6) the 06 does it in. i wish they did switch to E85 with the octane of alchohol. can you say 15:1 C/Ratio.

sorry about the spelling. i just had surgery.

'13_ImpactBlue_GT · Mar 3, 2006

What kind of surgery Bill?

USMstang · Mar 3, 2006

Skidawg said:
With my state's legislature mulling over mandating a 10% ehtanol blended fuel, I was curious to see if anyone knew any effects to the engine?

I currently live in a 10% ethanol area (mandated my the Feds), but have access to counties not under this requirement. When I get the chance, I take the short drive to fill up with the 100% fuel. If this mandate passes, I won't have this option.

Local "urban legends" have this blended fuel scouring the interior of fuel tanks and not buring correctly because the engines aren't really designed for this. A lot of GM owners of 90's models are claiming to be blowing through fuel injectors left and right.

I have a pretty good grasp on the differences between the fuels. I'm against such a mandate, and my state rep has heard my opposition. The vote is coming very soon and just might pass.

I'm just curious if any of you techies have any insight to the differences and effects to the engine...?

Thanks!

I sure wish I had the option of getting 10% or even 20% ethanol down here! All cars produced in the US now will run fine on up to a 20% blend. This is proven. There is lots of GOOD info on the net in reference to ethanol. The bad info is from your friends at the major oil companies and our friends in the Middle East. Even if I have to continue paying $2/gal for fuel, I would rather the profit go to some dadgum Hawkeye than a camel jockey. As far as the 100% fuel statement you made, I'm glad you said "fuel" because you are certainly not gettin 100% gasoline. There are all sorts of oxygenates in gas nowadays and many such as MTBE are bad news.
Check out ethanol.org for some good info. Keep an eye on Indy this year also, they are going to 90% methanol - 10% ethanol mix for 2006 and 100% ethanol for 2007 and beyond!

Mustang5L5 · Mar 3, 2006

I'm all for Ethanol E85 hitting the market. I think we need to get away from buying oil from countries with radical leaders. I think Ethanol has a future.

However, i don't think it's right to FORCE people over to ethanol. There should still be the option for 100% gas. We can't just jump over to ethanol like that. I think it will be about 10 years before it's widespread and commonplace, so buy stock in ethanol now!

I'm just worried about filling up my 5.0 in 10-15 years if we do go to ethanol.

USMstang · Mar 3, 2006

Mustang5L5 said:
I'm all for Ethanol E85 hitting the market. I think we need to get away from buying oil from countries with radical leaders. I think Ethanol has a future.

However, i don't think it's right to FORCE people over to ethanol. There should still be the option for 100% gas. We can't just jump over to ethanol like that. I think it will be about 10 years before it's widespread and commonplace, so buy stock in ethanol now!

I'm just worried about filling up my 5.0 in 10-15 years if we do go to ethanol.

It won't be an overnight issue. If you are old enough to remember leaded gas, it was phased out gradually. The main reason for adding 10% ethanol is not all about America or corn or not even the fact that it burns so much cleaner, it's really more about "oxygenates". MTBE has been outlawed in many states and rightfully so. The oil companies realize that ethanol works and is cleaner, and oh yeah, cheaper.
As far as the future of ethanol, do a search on Brazil. They started the switchover just after the Oil Imbargo of 1974 (see King Faizal of Saudi Arabia) and as of now, they pay $1/gal less for E85 than we do for standard gasoline. The octane rating is out of sight too, like the 104 neighborhood. It also put alot of people to work, IN THEIR OWN COUNTRY!

USMstang · Mar 3, 2006

droptopponynj said:
I welcome the use of ethanol, If e-85 was available in my area i would find out what i needed to convert and do it. More octane = more boost Screw the oil companies...Imagine the revitalization of the mid west farmers if we could use Corn as the major ingredient in our fuels.

they can also make it from sugar cane, sugar beets, switchgrass, garbage and the next big accomplishment will be the total utilization of the corn plant (and others too). One of the by-products of ethanol production from corn is feed. Only part of the kernel is used for fermentation, the other is high quality feed.
every thing I read on the production of grain alcohol sure does look nicer than oil production.

stangGT97 · Mar 4, 2006

yeah, i guess it would be nice to see the US be less dependent on the middle east for our oil supply, and let the corn farmers get some business! maybe the shell station near me just sucks, or im just paranoid that the ethanol is gonna blow my car up haha

billfisher · Mar 4, 2006

15:1 is the number that means something to me. also HO. can you say BIG hp.

hernia putting the 5.4 in. for real, it cost me.

Skidawg · Mar 9, 2006

Update: My state senate voted against the mandate. I will still have a choice of fuels to use.

The bill was defeated by 2 votes and my state rep voted 'no'.

USMstang · Mar 9, 2006

Skidawg said:
Update: My state senate voted against the mandate. I will still have a choice of fuels to use.

The bill was defeated by 2 votes and my state rep voted 'no'.

How very unfortunate for your state

FalconGuy016 · Mar 9, 2006

I get significantly reduced gas mileage with reformulated gasoline than "real" gas. I perform this experiment after learning the boundaries in my state (I travel in and out of the zones almost once a week).

Pirateinastang · Mar 9, 2006

I don't know any specs but apparently with E85 my Saab that I have as a beater will get more hp and tq!?! Sounds good to me!

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