Anyone ever buy and install a Full floor assembly in a 65 fastback.
CJ pony parts has a sale on them, are they any good or to thin.
CJ pony parts has a sale on them, are they any good or to thin.
full floor board
- Thread starter TOM B
- Start date
68Rustangs
New Member
I bought some parts from cj pony parts on their ebay site and i wouldnt buy from them again. I purchaced a set of floorpan supports and they sent me 2 different ones. One was a good quality one just like the original and the other was some piece of junk my 18 month old son could have made better. What kind of company sends you missmatched parts and then doesnt fix the problem? I dont know about their floorpans but i wont buy from them again and now i stick with year one and california mustang.
jerry S
New Member
I had a full-length floor pan installed on a 1969. It took some trimming to get it to fit but it did at the end. The quality is what it is which is to say that that it is better than the alternative.
One time I ordered a set of rack and pinion bushings from CJ Pony Parts. The bushings ended up being packaged wrong by the manufacturer and there was two different bushings inside the carton. One bushing was offset and the other was straight. This wasn't CJ's fault, but they took 4 months to get me a different set of bushings even with persistent phone calls. I'm glad that I didn't need them right away. They are usually quick to ship to you, but from my experience they have terrible customer support. Previously I had ordered a battery apron from them, the piece looked like it was formed with a sledgehammer. I have never seen a piece of sheetmetal in worse shape.
I have been very pleased with CJ. I have ordered parts from most of the bigger venders with the exception of Year 1 “I don’t have that kind of money” and keep going back to CJ. As for the floor pan, the one I look at was good. I chose to cut and patch in my car but I was fortunate enough to have that option. If I needed major repairs, I would get the one piece in a heartbeat.
BarnStang
Founding Member
Ever since they switched to a new shipping system (software) things seem to be harder...but we are here aboutfloor pans. If you are asking about the one piece, not the full length, we have ordered them from everyone. We have goodluck with Virginia Classic. We get most stuff from Kentucky Mustang. THey have been really great consistantly. And will price match CJ and Virgina Classic. We get big stuff from CJ cause they are close enough to go and pick up to save the shiping.
So, do you NEED a one piece floor pan? It makes a great finished job. No seams. But is a good deal of work to install. FUll length floor pans are easier to install (I think). We put the one piece in on request, in special cars (Shelby, Boss) and cars that are rusted too far to easily use a full length flor pan. Make sure you want to get into a one piece floor pan. If it was my car to keep, I would d it just cause I would want it to look as good as possble. But that's me.
So, do you NEED a one piece floor pan? It makes a great finished job. No seams. But is a good deal of work to install. FUll length floor pans are easier to install (I think). We put the one piece in on request, in special cars (Shelby, Boss) and cars that are rusted too far to easily use a full length flor pan. Make sure you want to get into a one piece floor pan. If it was my car to keep, I would d it just cause I would want it to look as good as possble. But that's me.
68Rustangs
New Member
Thats what ticked me off about them. I called and all the guy said was we have your number and well see what we can do. I shouldnt have to call them constantly to have a problem fixed and i didnt. I only called once to see if they would send me a new support and after talking to the guy it wasnt even worth it to me to bother calling back because i knew they werent going to take care of it. When you pay for a part i dont mind if it came damaged or two different floor pan supports like in my case but when they blow you off im not gonna give them my hard earned money again. I am going to be spending alot of money on this car and i plan on opening my own shop in the next few years. All i know is they lost alot of potential buisness from me just from crappy customer service. Im not trying to bash them or anything i know they have alot of good parts at good prices but i guess im just old fashioned about being taken care of as a customer. I called Year One for a part and the guy flat out told me i would have to beat the crap out of it to get it to install properly. Atleast they are up front about their products. Id rather spend more money for good customer service.
It will be a one piece floor.
So on a 65 fastback , how is this one piece installed and what needs to come out.
So on a 65 fastback , how is this one piece installed and what needs to come out.
BarnStang
Founding Member
Seat risers, and the whole floorboard from the bottom of the toe board to the bottom of the trunk divider (at the seams), and rocker to rocker.
It can come in through the windshield, or up from the bottom. I have not put one in from the bottom yet, ut have sen pictures ofit being done that way.
I usually cut the floor pan out with a plazma cutter, then air chisel off most of whats left, and use a spot weld cutter on the overlap at the bottom of the toe board and the bottom of the trunk divider to preserve the metal edges the floorboard is attached to. You will need to reattach the new pan to that.
I would highly recommend some bracing from the top of the cowl (under the lip) to the front of the frame where the bumper mounts and braces fom the bottm og the windshield piller to the top of the dor jamb. If you are leaving the doors and fenders on the car, at least try to use six sets of jack stands to support the car. Put the one set under the rear torque boxes, a set under the rockes at the front, and the third set under the front of the car at the core support.
It can come in through the windshield, or up from the bottom. I have not put one in from the bottom yet, ut have sen pictures ofit being done that way.
I usually cut the floor pan out with a plazma cutter, then air chisel off most of whats left, and use a spot weld cutter on the overlap at the bottom of the toe board and the bottom of the trunk divider to preserve the metal edges the floorboard is attached to. You will need to reattach the new pan to that.
I would highly recommend some bracing from the top of the cowl (under the lip) to the front of the frame where the bumper mounts and braces fom the bottm og the windshield piller to the top of the dor jamb. If you are leaving the doors and fenders on the car, at least try to use six sets of jack stands to support the car. Put the one set under the rear torque boxes, a set under the rockes at the front, and the third set under the front of the car at the core support.
BarnStang
Founding Member
If you need toe boards, bracing is almost manaditory. Inspect your cowl side panels and the firewall CAREFULLY. The ONLY thing holding the front of the car will be where the firewall attaches to the cowl side panels once the toe boards are cut loose. If the firewall is rusted through at the side cowl panels, and accross the top even a little, guess what will happen. (ask me how I know...)
You will need have all the surfaces preped and free of old metal and spot welds. Clean and paint the insides of the frame rails (floor supports). Wrestle the one piece pan in and position it where you want it to stay and outline the underside with a sharpie marker so you can drill holes to plug weld the new pan in place Lots and lots of holes. I see floor pans ALL the time where people put new pans in and don't weld it to the frame rails (floor supports). It's a unibody car. It needs to be reattached in the same places the old one was. Some may disagree, but I tell most people this: some engineer stayed up all night designing how that thing should be spot welded together. I don't presume to be smarter than that person. I weld them back in solid and safe. THe spec I have heard is one spot weld every 2" to 2.5". I try not to space my holes more than 3". Accross the toe boards, down the rockers, across the trunk divider, and around the frame rails front and back. And on top the torque boxes. Very hard place to get right.
Pressing the floor pan in place can be a challange. I usually have to use a porta-power to hold the floor pan down in a lot of places to get the plug welds flush. All welded on the top. Especially where it rolls up across the center floor support. You don't want to see gaps underneth. This is one area that may need some persuasion.
Also, to make sure it reaches rocker to rocker, try to flex the new pan at the tunnel to make it wider before you put it in for final install. Check this on the initial fit. On a 68, I had a good 1/4" gap at the RH rocker. A real pain to resolve once you start welding it in. Make sure your fit is good before the first weld goes in.
You will need have all the surfaces preped and free of old metal and spot welds. Clean and paint the insides of the frame rails (floor supports). Wrestle the one piece pan in and position it where you want it to stay and outline the underside with a sharpie marker so you can drill holes to plug weld the new pan in place Lots and lots of holes. I see floor pans ALL the time where people put new pans in and don't weld it to the frame rails (floor supports). It's a unibody car. It needs to be reattached in the same places the old one was. Some may disagree, but I tell most people this: some engineer stayed up all night designing how that thing should be spot welded together. I don't presume to be smarter than that person. I weld them back in solid and safe. THe spec I have heard is one spot weld every 2" to 2.5". I try not to space my holes more than 3". Accross the toe boards, down the rockers, across the trunk divider, and around the frame rails front and back. And on top the torque boxes. Very hard place to get right.
Pressing the floor pan in place can be a challange. I usually have to use a porta-power to hold the floor pan down in a lot of places to get the plug welds flush. All welded on the top. Especially where it rolls up across the center floor support. You don't want to see gaps underneth. This is one area that may need some persuasion.
Also, to make sure it reaches rocker to rocker, try to flex the new pan at the tunnel to make it wider before you put it in for final install. Check this on the initial fit. On a 68, I had a good 1/4" gap at the RH rocker. A real pain to resolve once you start welding it in. Make sure your fit is good before the first weld goes in.
Wow thanks for the info guys, sounds like a lot of work but It needs to be done.
so most of you take it through the windshield. does anyone have pics of this job or know of a site
so most of you take it through the windshield. does anyone have pics of this job or know of a site
I am planning on doing a full floor pan on a 65 fastback as well, but it will need new toe boards, front frame rails and likely rockers (it isn't torn apart yet, but I know bondo is in the rockers and it will likely be a total tear down), where/how do you suggest bracing the car for this? I was guessing it would just have to be done one piece at a time, but I don't know the order either. (Sorry if I am highjacking your thread.)
BarnStang
Founding Member
Wow. I could write several pages. Do the rockers first. If the rockers can't be repaired, then replace one rocker at a time. THere are options here too. You can get a whole rocker panel, or a rocker skin. THe skin is just the outer cover. If the rest is ok, then you can get away with the skin. You may also be able to cut the old skin off and patch repair the rocker and put a new skin on. Still a lot of work. If you are going to replace the whole rocker, you will need some bracking welded in place. I'll try to post some pictures of some bracing, but that may have to be later.
I addressed the hazard of cutting out the toe boards previously.
Some oppertunities are also present. here. One, if you are pulling the whole rocker out, consider replacing the rocker with convertible rockers. No sub frame connectors needed...if you are cutting out the toe boards and floor boards, (65 right?) consider adding torque boxes to the front on both sides.
Once you have that nightmare done
then put in new toe boards, then the floor pan goes on top. Look at the original seams. See how the pieces go together.
Oh, frame rails. I would "probably" put the frame rails in before I cut out the old floor pan. And leave them unattached to the floor pan. THat would keep the angle and height correct. THis may not be practical, so you can take a bunch of measurements. Note: Once the flootpan and toe boards are out, there is nothing holding the front frame other than the cowl side panels. Make sure the cross brace that runs under the oil pan is in place and the bolts are tight. THis keeps the rail spacing correct if the cowl side panels are rusted. THere are many ways to attach this stuff. Others may have a different approach. Find what works best for you.
I addressed the hazard of cutting out the toe boards previously.
Some oppertunities are also present. here. One, if you are pulling the whole rocker out, consider replacing the rocker with convertible rockers. No sub frame connectors needed...if you are cutting out the toe boards and floor boards, (65 right?) consider adding torque boxes to the front on both sides.
Once you have that nightmare done
then put in new toe boards, then the floor pan goes on top. Look at the original seams. See how the pieces go together. Oh, frame rails. I would "probably" put the frame rails in before I cut out the old floor pan. And leave them unattached to the floor pan. THat would keep the angle and height correct. THis may not be practical, so you can take a bunch of measurements. Note: Once the flootpan and toe boards are out, there is nothing holding the front frame other than the cowl side panels. Make sure the cross brace that runs under the oil pan is in place and the bolts are tight. THis keeps the rail spacing correct if the cowl side panels are rusted. THere are many ways to attach this stuff. Others may have a different approach. Find what works best for you.
BarnStang
Founding Member
Rather than me fighting with getting my pictures to fit on here (royal pain) here is a link to our site:
http://www.marylandmusclecar.com/Page3.html
On this page you can see the bracing I welded in. Door jamb to door jamb, then jamb to piller. You can barely see the bracing I put on the dog box. Cowl to battery apron (right in the corner), rocker to battery apron, rocker to frame rail, and a cross piece between the two long runs. SOrry, it's hard to see.
Here it is. Check out the slide show. You can see a great picture of the bracing on the drivers side. You can click the individual pictures so it will stay on the frame.
http://www.marylandmusclecar.com/Page12.html
http://www.marylandmusclecar.com/Page3.html
On this page you can see the bracing I welded in. Door jamb to door jamb, then jamb to piller. You can barely see the bracing I put on the dog box. Cowl to battery apron (right in the corner), rocker to battery apron, rocker to frame rail, and a cross piece between the two long runs. SOrry, it's hard to see.
Here it is. Check out the slide show. You can see a great picture of the bracing on the drivers side. You can click the individual pictures so it will stay on the frame.
http://www.marylandmusclecar.com/Page12.html
VTStang66
Founding Member
Good info. I'm actually about to attempt this same thing myself. I have the full pan, toe boards, trans tunnel brace, and 2 front frame rails to go in. The car was rusted out pretty bad and the PO did a terrible hack job of fixing it (panels screwed in above and below the rotten ones). I'm waiting on a spot weld cutting bit which should be here in a day or two, then I'm gonna finish cutting out the old pan.
So there's no way to get it in through the door? I have the doors off, I didn't try to squeeze it in there yet, just figured it would probably fit. I'm going to take the windshield out anyway because it needs to be replaced, but I don't even know how to do that yet. I think it needs a special tool to remove the trim, right?
*edit*
I got all my metal from NPD, top notch stuff, comes from USA and Canada, except for the tunnel brace (Taiwan). I don't know how well that'll fit but we'll see soon...
So there's no way to get it in through the door? I have the doors off, I didn't try to squeeze it in there yet, just figured it would probably fit. I'm going to take the windshield out anyway because it needs to be replaced, but I don't even know how to do that yet. I think it needs a special tool to remove the trim, right?
*edit*
I got all my metal from NPD, top notch stuff, comes from USA and Canada, except for the tunnel brace (Taiwan). I don't know how well that'll fit but we'll see soon...
I guess I have to fix that broken bolt first. Any suggestions on how to do this? (As far as I have to go, I may as well almost cut that whole part out and well a fresh one in with a new bolt.)
Ok, how different are the conv rockers? It this a direct swap and it just fills in?
Torque boxs.. I never really understood what they were/how theyworked/what they looked like. (I understand it keeps thing from twisting, but if I don't understand it, it means nothing to me.) How do you put these on the front?
Also, for:
front frame rails
full floor pan
toe boards
rocker panels
Who do you suggest I get each of these parts from?
The year one full floor pan seems to be the only one with the full trans tunnel (from the pictures at least).
Thanks for the help. She is a total rust-stang, but a true GT. So I figure, if I work really hard, after I die, my not yet born kids can sell it for what I have into it.
BarnStang
Founding Member
THere are a couple ways to deal with the brace nut. You could cut a hole in the frame to get to it. WHat I did with the whole frame on the bench, I took a step bit and opened up the hole where the nut goes so I kept the hole centered. But not bigger than the outside diameter of the new nut. I fished the nut down the frame with an extension magnet and ran a bolt into it through the hole. Got it level and held it in place bt hand and tack welded it to hold it, took the bolt out and layed a good bead of weld around it. Worked great.
THe convertible rockers are much larger. Lots to cut out. Never done it. Have seen pictures on here. You will have to use convertible kick panels. Can't help much with that.
Torque boxes in the front. Look at a 67 or 68. I think the 68 only has one in the drivers side, and the 68 has both sides? Can't remember. 69-70 has both sides. If you look behind your front wheel, that big empty void is filled witha torque box. Strengthens the frame. You can order the whole torque box. Post back when you are ready to install them.
Get parts from any of the large vendors. Many are mentioned repeatedly in the forums. It depends on where you are. We use Virginai Classic and CJ Pony cause the shipping is less. Closer to where we are. I also use Kentucky Mustang a lot simply because they have always treated us great. And they will price match the other vendors.
THe convertible rockers are much larger. Lots to cut out. Never done it. Have seen pictures on here. You will have to use convertible kick panels. Can't help much with that.
Torque boxes in the front. Look at a 67 or 68. I think the 68 only has one in the drivers side, and the 68 has both sides? Can't remember. 69-70 has both sides. If you look behind your front wheel, that big empty void is filled witha torque box. Strengthens the frame. You can order the whole torque box. Post back when you are ready to install them.
Get parts from any of the large vendors. Many are mentioned repeatedly in the forums. It depends on where you are. We use Virginai Classic and CJ Pony cause the shipping is less. Closer to where we are. I also use Kentucky Mustang a lot simply because they have always treated us great. And they will price match the other vendors.
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