Rack and Pinion Spindle

[degins]

I've had two threads dealing with Mustang spindles that have evolved into discussions of the merit of producing a R&P spindle. I am skeptical as to the size of this market. I realize that most posters to this site are not concerned about markets for Mustang parts, but I can't make them if I can't sell them. You guys have a lot more experience on the subject of R&P applications. I admit that I'm more interested in OEM and near OEM applications; mild mods. So, If you wish, please feel free to discuss the application. Please be specific about name brands and or year and model of the rack, front or rear steer, track width, mods needed to make it work, year Mustang it applies to, and important to me, the difference in the 3D position of the tie rod mount (in or outboard, up or down, front or back). Thanks.

 

[bnickel]

degins, like i said in the other thread www.pro-motorsports.com has a bolt on solution already although that was not really it's intended purpose it should work just fine.

if you want to pursue the modified spindle you might contact the 3 major rack suppliers and get their opinions on the product. www.totalcontrolproducts.com , www.randallsrack.com , www.speeddirect.com you might also contact www.rrs-online.com but they usually try to sell their own strut conversions so they might not want to participate. if you can get these rack and pinion guys to get on board with the spindle you might be able to sell quite a few of them. i know at one time randalls rack had instructions on his site on how to modify the stock granada spindle for this exact issue. i'd be willing to bet he would get on board and sell some of them for or at the least he might recommend them and refer customers you're way. since most of the better aftermarket rack are based on the j-car rack design (randalls rack, speed direct) or are at least similar in design to the j-car rack (TCP) or the european and australian opel versions (RRS), i would concentrate on those. don't even bother with trying to make a front steer spindle as there would be too much competition from the mustang II suspension and steering companies as that is what most people use if they don't use one of the above listed units. there is the faming river rack as well but there is no amount of anything that will help that design, just plain poor engineering on FR's part. www.unisteer.com is supposed to be working on a manual steer rack kit that is also rear steer like all of the other rack kits i mentioned (except the M II) and they may be interested as well.

just trying to help you out with this as much as possible

 

[Edbert]

Yeah, from a marketing point of view you are going to need to get your parts in front of cutomers. No matter how much we might decry the effectiveness of some 4-color splashy ads and catalogs they WORK. Since you are relatively small outfit you might be able to move more product if these were sold through other channels and you became more like a wholesaler than a retailer. Get your product added to the catalogs for the products listed above. Customers who just want a rack will buy it, those who want improved performance and geometry will add your part to the shopping cart, those who need the drum-to-disc brake upgrade will too of course.

 

[Tubo(2-bo)]

Checking with different R & P mfgrs. isnt a bad idea. A consistent problem, is reduced turning radius. The steering racks being adapted dont have enough lateral movement to turn the wheels tight enough, to even equal the car's origional turning radius Relocating the outer tie rod mount, on the spindles's steering arm, approximately 1 1/4 in closer to the hub would change the geometry enough to eliminate the problem.
Different setups would of course need diferent tie rod mounting locations, the 1 1/4in is just approximate.
I used to be heavily involved with racing catamaran sailboats. The twin rudder steering is not unlike the steering on a car, and there are geometry forumlas avaliable to determine; steering arm lengths and akerman angles, based on turning radius & track(distance between wheels or rudders) In fact most of the formulas we used on the boats were automotive based.

bnickle could check with the Texas Tech mechanical engineering dept, and not only find the akerman formulas, but also learn that a steering rack may be relocated in a different orentation than origional, and not loose it's function. I.E. a fox rack in a 65 Mustang chassis.

 

[brianj5600]

There may be a market for people just wanting quicker steering. There are a few catalogs with quick steer kits in them. You could use the same casting, just leave enough meat to machine a hole closer to the KP.

 

[LMan]

I may be completely off, but as long as R&P kits stay at 1000.00 or above, they will not become common upgrades the way, say, front disc brakes have.

This will limit your sales significantly until that price point is firmly broken.

 

[66Runt]

Don't design for bumpsteer

It's going to be different depending on set up anyways.
As for a Rack and Pinion only spindle, how about designing a track spindle for those that want less Ackerman, but not faster steering and could care less about loosing 12" turning radius, and a street spindle that moves the tie rod hole 1" closer in to the centerline of the spindle, and maintains Ackerman? For those that do care about turning radius.

Two spindles instead of a bunch. We buy a bumpsteer kit that allows us to adjust the suspension where ever our little ole hearts desire, any time we feel the need to change it. Same spindle does the job, just change the bumpsteer shims.

I think the Pro-motorsports kit only works if you've got the right UCA drop combined with just the right spring drop. It is not adjustable, like a Bear tracker.

What am I missing?

Scott