Those with strokers

[AznStanger3v]

hey man, im very interested in it. how long are you trying to keep it for? i just got a job today and i have many bills to pay. Ive got rent, school loans, cell phone, internet, cable, utilities, insurance, and gas. as you can see, im swamped but im definently interested. Pm me with some stuff about it:

Mileage
specifics

you know, that stuff. thanks man

 

[Rootus]

You can get a DSS Pro Bullet 347 with forged internals for 2499.99, brand new. That's probably what I'd do if I didn't want to try building it myself.

Dave

 

[xYoung347x]

but does the DSS Pro Bullet 347 has the Compcam, oil pump, canton 7qt oil pan, Main Girdle, 94-95 timing cover, new waterpump, new motor mounts, motorsport balancer, and 28oz aluminum flywheel? Best of all its complete, just slap some heads, intake, headers, brackets, and some sensors and you're good to go. BTW, check your pm 17yroldstanger.
-Young

 

[Grn92LX]

Go with the place I suggested for a shortblock. Cheaper and built better.

I dont think the combo I suggested would be as bad on gas as you'd think. But anyway, forged crank in a stock block is a waste of money and can hurt power. Its heavier. A cast crank from the brands I suggested is good till 600hp.

xyoung347x had a nice streetable combo with awesome low end tq. I would prefer more hp though, but sounds like his combo is what your looking for. I'd use the afr 185's, rpm 2 with ported inlet for a 75mm TB and an ed curtis cam then or a jay allen cam. THis will make 380-390rwhp. Not enough for me for a 347 but should be good for you. Fwiw, my friends bolt on 03 cobra runs mid 11's @ 121. Wanna play, you gotta pay

 

[revhead347]

Some of you are a little confused. A 347 won't make any more power than a 302. It will just produce the same power at a lower rpm. A 347 doesn't put stress on the cylinder walls. The rod length/stroke ratio isn't that bad. Chevy small block 400 has a wosre rod length/stroke ratio, and that motor will go as far as any other Chevy motor.

The guy who built my 347 is shifting his 347 at 8500 rpms. Where it tops out has nothing to do with cylinder loading. It depends on what set of heads and cam you are running.

Put a 347 kit in used 5.0 block. Don't buy a new block, because the quality isn't as good as a factory block. Don't bother doing anything to the block if you are not going over 6500 rpms. They all crack at the same load regardless of what you do to them.

Kurt

 

[Rootus]

Some of you are a little confused.

I think you're right .

A 347 won't make any more power than a 302.

That does not make any sense.

A 347 doesn't put stress on the cylinder walls. The rod length/stroke ratio isn't that bad. Chevy small block 400 has a wosre rod length/stroke ratio, and that motor will go as far as any other Chevy motor.

The "problem" with a 347 is that it is starting with a 302 block, and you're running out of cylinder wall.

The guy who built my 347 is shifting his 347 at 8500 rpms. Where it tops out has nothing to do with cylinder loading. It depends on what set of heads and cam you are running.

Heads & cam definitely play a role, but the bottom end is usually the limiting factor in turning RPM.

Put a 347 kit in used 5.0 block. Don't buy a new block, because the quality isn't as good as a factory block.

I'm pretty sure they're both factory blocks, and quality is similar. Used blocks have other advantages that have nothing to do with quality.

Dave

 

[Joes95GT]

The differences in Rod angularity between a 331 and 347, both with a 5.400 rod, is less than one when the calculations are done. Rod angularity, I believe, contributes to piston side-loading, which in turn contributes to stress on cylinder walls. Both are moot.

Bigger is better, if you have the heads, manifold, and cam to support to it.

Cast cranks can be spun to (a conservative) 7000 RPM without a problem, as long as the rotating assembly has been professionally balanced. H-beams aren't necessary in MOST N/A applications. I'd find decent I-beam rods; plus they're lighter to boot. Probe slugs are the best for the money. I'd find something half-way light with the right valve reliefs (if necessary), and have at it.

Good discussion......

Joe

 

[revhead347]

I swear that the blocks Ford sells to the aftermarket are rejects that they aren't willing to put in cars and warranty. I have heard some horror stories about new Ford blocks. I would just use an old one, there are plenty of them out there.

A 347 is a .030 overbore 302, which is nothing. The cylinders still aren't thin enough to make a difference. If it really bothers you, you can always build a 342, which has no overbore.

The power output of the engine is completely dependent on the flow capacity of the heads and cam. Once the flow capacity has been obtained, you are at max power. The 302 will reach the flow capacity of the combination, but you will have to spin it higher to get there. There are a few factors that might cause a 347 to make a hair more power, but the difference is negligible.

The bottom end is one of the limiting factors in turning high rpms, but it has nothing to do with the stroke of the engine. The limiting factor in the bottom end starts when the mains start to walk. If you are using a stock block with no main support a 347 and a 302 are going to top out at the same rpm. The main rpm limiting factor is actually the valvetrain. Don't expect to get it much above 6500 rpms with stock hydraulic valvetrain.

Kurt

 

[revhead347]

The differences in Rod angularity between a 331 and 347, both with a 5.400 rod, is less than one when the calculations are done. Rod angularity, I believe, contributes to piston side-loading, which in turn contributes to stress on cylinder walls. Both are moot.

Joe

Amen

 

[4Jenna]

If your gonna run a blower get a good crank. My stock crank split into 2 pieces. There's alotta stress on that sucker when you have a blower. I'm running a Eagle kit
331
4340 Crank and 4340 H beams

I think some of these guys have pointed you in the wrong direction, they have recc. some radical setups. Keep that in mind when your picking parts for your street car.

 

[Joes95GT]

I swear that the blocks Ford sells to the aftermarket are rejects that they aren't willing to put in cars and warranty. I have heard some horror stories about new Ford blocks. I would just use an old one, there are plenty of them out there.

Yes, I've heard the same.

A 347 is a .030 overbore 302, which is nothing. The cylinders still aren't thin enough to make a difference. If it really bothers you, you can always build a 342, which has no overbore.

A 347 not only is a 0.030 overbore, it's another 0.400" of stroke, which is huge.

The power output of the engine is completely dependent on the flow capacity of the heads and cam. Once the flow capacity has been obtained, you are at max power. The 302 will reach the flow capacity of the combination, but you will have to spin it higher to get there. There are a few factors that might cause a 347 to make a hair more power, but the difference is negligible.

If you use the same parts from the 302 onto the 347 yes. If not, then no.

Kurt has some very valid points. I touched up on a few of them because he wasn't being descript enough.

Why does the 347 make more power than the 302? More cubic inches, yes, but that's not what I'm trying to get at. Piston speeds are increased because of the increase in stroke. The piston has to travel a further distance in the same amount of time. What does that mean? Greater speed.

When speed is increased, the air volume must too. Think of it this way: When the piston is traveling down in the bore on the intake stroke (intake valve open), it's traveling faster than it would with a stock 302 stroke. This in turn, creates a harder suction affect, pulling more air in, helping feed the increase in cubic inches.

Piston speed = Stroke x ( RPM / 6)

On a 302 with AFR 165 heads, it seems to run out of steam at about 6000 RPM. This is a piston speed of approximately 3000 ft/min. The same piston speed can be matched by the 347 at ~5300 RPM. By spinning the 347 to (a very safe) 6000 RPM, you are now acheiving a PS of ~3400 ft/min; something that would take the 302 6800 RPM to acheive.

To take advantage of these increased speeds, you need a cylinder head, camshaft, and manifold that can supply the adequate amount of air to feed the combination.

This is very simplified still, but I think it helps contribute to the discussion...

Joe

 

[306stroker]

build a 306 stroker!

 

[Rootus]

build a 306 stroker!

What are you going to stroke to get a 306?

 

[Grn92LX]

What are you going to stroke to get a 306?

His cack n balls

Bigger is better, if you have the heads, manifold, and cam to support to it.

Yup, I agree

Some of you are a little confused. A 347 won't make any more power than a 302. It will just produce the same power at a lower rpm.

The guy who built my 347 is shifting his 347 at 8500 rpms

Theres so much contradiction here, its like im reading a bible.

Such confusion of out such a little deal. Do the 347, absolutely NO reason not to. For the original poster since you dont wanna go crazy, do your afr 185's, rpm2 intake and your ed c cam. Expect around 380rwhp and nice low end tq. I'd do a dart block, afr 205's, victor 5.0, 75mm race TB (90mm opening) 42's and a killer custom cam and make 450hp+ and run 10.50's

 

[xYoung347x]

Go with the place I suggested for a shortblock. Cheaper and built better.

I dont think the combo I suggested would be as bad on gas as you'd think. But anyway, forged crank in a stock block is a waste of money and can hurt power. Its heavier. A cast crank from the brands I suggested is good till 600hp.

xyoung347x had a nice streetable combo with awesome low end tq. I would prefer more hp though, but sounds like his combo is what your looking for. I'd use the afr 185's, rpm 2 with ported inlet for a 75mm TB and an ed curtis cam then or a jay allen cam. THis will make 380-390rwhp. Not enough for me for a 347 but should be good for you. Fwiw, my friends bolt on 03 cobra runs mid 11's @ 121. Wanna play, you gotta pay

Umm I do make 375hp 410tq with it being a safe and reliable. You forgot to look at the FIRST run that I made 388hp 418tq .

A 347 won't make any more power than a 302.

I don't agree with this niether.

build a 306 stroker!

a 306 stroker is a freshen up 302 bro.

 

[Grn92LX]

Did I say you didnt make that power?

What I said was thats not enough for me to justify a 347. That is good power for what you have, dont get me wrong. I just prefer over 400 to be better

 

[306stroker]

oh sorry i guess ill to put it proper a long rod 306, not just a freshend up 302

 

[revhead347]

His cack n balls



Yup, I agree






Theres so much contradiction here, its like im reading a bible.

It's not a condradiction. Motor building is not a simple issue. It's not as simple as bigger is better. He shifts it at 8500 rpms because it's an 8.6 second car.

Kurt

 

[AznStanger3v]

im liking all the views of everyone. please, continue

 

[Grn92LX]

Budget? How fast you wanna go? I've suggested a few combo's in this thread for ya. It sounds like xyoung's combo is right up your alley.I'd use the rpm2 intake at minimum. Will you have ed do a cam or will you try someone else? I was gonna go with jay allen and he recommended the victor for my car, but I was set on the TFS R. 1 3/4" LT's are a must.