Timeserts and TFS heads experience

John3 · May 22, 2018

Long story short I bought a 93 Fox off eBay without seeing the car in person, I know that I deserve what’s been coming.

Anyway this car is modded quit a bit but has a good amount of problems. First issue I need to take care of is a stripped spark plug hole. In doing a tune up to try and get this car running better I found 1 plug stripped. As I was threading a new plug in it felt a little loose but I got it hand tight. I then went to just snug it up and it slips. It will snug up by hand and feel tight but if I go anymore it slips. So I saw some guys like timeserts but I didn’t see anyone’s opinion on using them with TFS heads.

I’d like to give more info on the heads but I don’t even know the model number for sure without taking off the valve cover. I believe the main poor running engine issue was related to bad gasket seals on the lower intake to heads. So I already have the intake off and now I’m saying I should take that head off and fix that plug hole now. I’m not afraid of attempting the timeserts, I just wanted to get some first hand experience opinions. Also, do you think I should just pull both heads and timesert all the plugs? I only ask because the other plugs felt a little loose while hand thr adding them in but they did snug up tight and not slip.

Thanks,
John

87 black gt · May 23, 2018

John3 said:
Long story short I bought a 93 Fox off eBay without seeing the car in person, I know that I deserve what’s been coming.

Anyway this car is modded quit a bit but has a good amount of problems. First issue I need to take care of is a stripped spark plug hole. In doing a tune up to try and get this car running better I found 1 plug stripped. As I was threading a new plug in it felt a little loose but I got it hand tight. I then went to just snug it up and it slips. It will snug up by hand and feel tight but if I go anymore it slips. So I saw some guys like timeserts but I didn’t see anyone’s opinion on using them with TFS heads.

I’d like to give more info on the heads but I don’t even know the model number for sure without taking off the valve cover. I believe the main poor running engine issue was related to bad gasket seals on the lower intake to heads. So I already have the intake off and now I’m saying I should take that head off and fix that plug hole now. I’m not afraid of attempting the timeserts, I just wanted to get some first hand experience opinions. Also, do you think I should just pull both heads and timesert all the plugs? I only ask because the other plugs felt a little loose while hand thr adding them in but they did snug up tight and not slip.

Thanks,
John

I would call trick flow

John3 · May 24, 2018

87 black gt said:
I would call trick flow

Yeah looks like that’s what I’ll have to do. I’ll be back with more questions I’m sure.

Thanks

2000xp8 · May 25, 2018

I'd pull the heads completely off and take them to a machine shop.
While they are there, they can fix the hole, go through them completely and give them a valve job.

Should cost a couple hundred bucks, maybe a little more because of the stripped hole.
This way when you bolt them back down you will be 100% sure they are right.
An added bonus is that the car will run better and likely provide another 10-15rwhp.

There also could be a serial number engraved in the outside of the head, if there is, take that number and call tfs they will tell you what it is and when it was made.

John3 · May 26, 2018

Well I got lucky. I have the intake off and a bunch of other stuff now out of the way so I figured I would take a second look at the suspected stripped plug before pulling the heads. Sure enough it’s bit stripped, I was at s bad angle for that last plug and the socket must have been slipping. So it’s always good to do the double check......

The intake intake gasket was def leaking as I could see the gasket was bad around the water ports and even around a couple runner ports. I’ll prob start up another thread as I have some questions about what’s going on with this car.

Thanks for the help, John

General karthief · May 26, 2018

You can keep this thread going with your new obstacles just change the title to fit the problem and the members following already know what your dealing with

John3 · May 26, 2018

I need to figure out how to change the thread title, did a little searching but didn’t see it. I’m on my phone so maybe that’s an issue.

So where to begin, I guess arrival would be a good start. This car came up from Florida and was dropped off in the dead of PA winter. Right away I noticed 3 things.

1st, The car is an AOD, and when you give it gas it almost wants to stall out. I’m a stick guy and to me it feels how a slipping clutch feels. Once you get above 1500-2000 rpms it starts to go ok. I haven’t been able to drive this car yet so I haven’t gotten on it and honestly the way it was acting I was afraid something was going to break.

2nd, I noticed that after turning the car off it would spit out a good amount of coolant. It did this until the coolant got low and now it doesn’t do it. I’m sure if I fill it up it would have done it again til low.

3rd, the idle is terrible. The car has a E303 cam and I’ve read a lot about the issues with this cam. But I’ve seen enough people with them where they work to know I have something else going on. To me I was thinking big vacuum leak. That led me to reading up and finding many people experience intake to head gasket failure. This car has a cobra intake(not Chinese version) and TFS heads, so I thought there was a good chance the gasket seal was not good. So I took the intake out and discovered the gaskets were bad. They were regular 1250 felpros and they melted around the water ports and appeared to have leaked around some of the intake ports. The lower intake bolts were also very loose when I took them out, so maybe they were never retorqued after running the engine hot. I think my coolant issue might be related to this too. I’m thinking air pressure might have been leaking into the coolant port causing it to pressurize and spew coolant. Just a thought. My other thought was blown or poorly installed head gaskets. The oil looks coolant free and clean and the coolant looked oil free when I drained it.

Right now I have the intake off and I’m actually porting the lower by following Tmoss’s Guide. I always wanted to try this and now have some time. I bought new Delphi 1250s3 gaskets with the steel core. I’m prepping everything back up to reinstall the intake.

Here’s what I know about the car but can only take the guys word which honestly has not been very good so far. The engine was rebuilt and has less than 20 miles on it since getting it running. Don’t know it that’s true at all. Not sure what model TFS heads, I’m praying at this point the guy installed the rods, rockers, springs,ect right. The car is kinda strange in that it has a lot of stock items considering some of the mods. The entire intake side from throttle body to air silencer is just orig stuff. The AOD and rear are the stock. The interior is stock and in decent shape.

Considering I have the intake off should I dig deeper? I really don’t want to remove the heads unless I have to but I know that can tell me more. Prob is at that point I’m almost redoing everything. Below is a pic of the intake gasket and a car shot. It was the color that pomade me pull the trigger.....

87 black gt · May 26, 2018

John3 said:
I need to figure out how to change the thread title, did a little searching but didn’t see it. I’m on my phone so maybe that’s an issue.

So where to begin, I guess arrival would be a good start. This car came up from Florida and was dropped off in the dead of PA winter. Right away I noticed 3 things.

1st, The car is an AOD, and when you give it gas it almost wants to stall out. I’m a stick guy and to me it feels how a slipping clutch feels. Once you get above 1500-2000 rpms it starts to go ok. I haven’t been able to drive this car yet so I haven’t gotten on it and honestly the way it was acting I was afraid something was going to break.

2nd, I noticed that after turning the car off it would spit out a good amount of coolant. It did this until the coolant got low and now it doesn’t do it. I’m sure if I fill it up it would have done it again til low.

3rd, the idle is terrible. The car has a E303 cam and I’ve read a lot about the issues with this cam. But I’ve seen enough people with them where they work to know I have something else going on. To me I was thinking big vacuum leak. That led me to reading up and finding many people experience intake to head gasket failure. This car has a cobra intake(not Chinese version) and TFS heads, so I thought there was a good chance the gasket seal was not good. So I took the intake out and discovered the gaskets were bad. They were regular 1250 felpros and they melted around the water ports and appeared to have leaked around some of the intake ports. The lower intake bolts were also very loose when I took them out, so maybe they were never retorqued after running the engine hot. I think my coolant issue might be related to this too. I’m thinking air pressure might have been leaking into the coolant port causing it to pressurize and spew coolant. Just a thought. My other thought was blown or poorly installed head gaskets. The oil looks coolant free and clean and the coolant looked oil free when I drained it.

Right now I have the intake off and I’m actually porting the lower by following Tmoss’s Guide. I always wanted to try this and now have some time. I bought new Delphi 1250s3 gaskets with the steel core. I’m prepping everything back up to reinstall the intake.

Here’s what I know about the car but can only take the guys word which honestly has not been very good so far. The engine was rebuilt and has less than 20 miles on it since getting it running. Don’t know it that’s true at all. Not sure what model TFS heads, I’m praying at this point the guy installed the rods, rockers, springs,ect right. The car is kinda strange in that it has a lot of stock items considering some of the mods. The entire intake side from throttle body to air silencer is just orig stuff. The AOD and rear are the stock. The interior is stock and in decent shape.

Considering I have the intake off should I dig deeper? I really don’t want to remove the heads unless I have to but I know that can tell me more. Prob is at that point I’m almost redoing everything. Below is a pic of the intake gasket and a car shot. It was the color that pomade me pull the trigger.....

87 black gt · May 26, 2018

First thing I noticed in your picture ,is that the intake manifold gasket at water jacket opening, there is a tab that is to be cut off , so that tells me the previous owner did not read the directions on how to install gaskets. tfs heads have a number stamped on the outside face as to what size heads they are .

John3 · May 26, 2018

Yeah my confidence on how this engine was done is not high. I’m hoping the heads are done right. I did find some info from the listing when I bought the car. See attached pic with details.

My goal here is not to redo the whole car but to get it streetable. I actually have another 93 that is going to be my true project and I really just wanted this car for cruises around on a nice day until the other car is done. Of course I may have 2 projects now.....

87 black gt · May 26, 2018

John3 said:
Yeah my confidence on how this engine was done is not high. I’m hoping the heads are done right. I did find some info from the listing when I bought the car. See attached pic with details

My goal here is not to redo the whole car but to get it streetable. I actually have another 93 that is going to be my true project and I really just wanted this car for cruises around on a nice day until the other car is done. Of course I may have 2 projects now.....

the heads should be bolt on and go, unless he had work done to them.

John3 · May 27, 2018

Is there a way for me to see if the cam was correctly degreed when installed without taking the heads off?

87 black gt · May 27, 2018

John3 said:
Is there a way for me to see if the cam was correctly degreed when installed without taking the heads off?

No, the only thing you can do is remove timing cover and look at the crank timing gear to see if he advance, or retarted timing , or if it is dot to dot

John3 · May 27, 2018

Well I guess I’m going to reinstall the intake. I finished porting and polishing the lower today.

2 more quick questions. The intake is powder coated including the gasket surfaces. Will that cause any bonding issues with the gaskets? And if I were to remove a valve cover do I need a new gasket or is the gasket reusable if in good shape?

Thanks, John

87 black gt · May 27, 2018

John3 said:
Well I guess I’m going to reinstall the intake. I finished porting and polishing the lower today.

2 more quick questions. The intake is powder coated including the gasket surfaces. Will that cause any bonding issues with the gaskets? And if I were to remove a valve cover do I need a new gasket or is the gasket reusable if in good shape?

Thanks, John

yes the intake needs to be cleaned off of that powder coating , to seal and sit correct on the heads and on The second question , some are reusable and some are not

a91what · May 28, 2018

Cork gaskets are not reusable, the blue colored rubber ones are.

John3 · May 29, 2018

I cleaned up the gasket surfaces of the powder coat with a long sanding block. Lower intake is installed and I’m hoping to have it back together this weekend for a start up.

I saw in some places online they suggest 20# foot torque and others 25#. I went with 20 and I have to say I feel like anymore and I would have been chancing pulling the aluminum threads.

87 black gt · May 29, 2018

John3 said:
I cleaned up the gasket surfaces of the powder coat with a long sanding block. Lower intake is installed and I’m hoping to have it back together this weekend for a start up.

I saw in some places online they suggest 20# foot torque and others 25#. I went with 25 and I have to say I feel like anymore and I would have been chancing pulling the aluminum threads.[/QUOTE 23-25, also re-check torque after a few drives, I have the 170 twisted wedge and the lower intake bolts were a little loose re-torqued and good to go

John3 · May 29, 2018

Oops I meant to say I went with 20#, not 25. Even at 20 it felt on the verge.

87 black gt · May 30, 2018

John3 said:
Oops I meant to say I went with 20#, not 25. Even at 20 it felt on the verge.

Get arp bolts, if you take intake off again and if you remove heads

Timeserts and TFS heads experience

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wonder how much it would cost to ship you a pair

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