tune or tweecer?

1994Vib.RedGT · Oct 10, 2005

Im looking to tune my combo once the new heads and cam go in at christmas time, and Ive got two options: 1)dyno tune-last time i saw these being done with a chip burned for your car it was $600! or 2)buy a tweecer-I have not the foggiest clue on how to use this, but everyone here seems to have good things to say about it, also if I go with the tweecer route, does one work for all fords because my friend has a 97 cobra and we were talking about going in on one together.

So what do you suggest?

Zero Signal · Oct 10, 2005

It's not something that you can share. The tweecer IS the chip. SO if you take it out, you lose the tune. Not to mention it's not that easy to install, it requires an hour at least.

Still, for the money, it would be more for the tweecer once you get dyno time in. If you only plan to tune once and forget it, then go with the custom burned chip.

CManT1914 · Oct 10, 2005

The twEECer will work with the Cobra, but as John said, it's a piggyback system, meaning it has to stay hooked up.

That being said, if I were to do it again, I'd just get a dyno-tune. The reason solely being I don't have the time required to mess with the twEECer. It does take a lot of time to learn and make adjustments. You gotta figure in the price of a wideband if you want to get a decent tune with it. That's another $200+. I am seriously thinking about selling my twEECer and wideband to offset the cost of a dyno-tune I want to get. I'm tired of working on the stang, I just want to be done with it.

blksn955.o · Oct 10, 2005

Something that realy needs to be looked at

1. You have to be willing to put the time .

2. You have to be interested in learn about your cars EEC and how it works.

3. You have to be patient and take baby steps, it will not come to you over night (god only knows how I wish it was so).

4. You notice everything starts with YOU and your not scared, but feel up to the challenge.

If you do not feel your up to the task and do not want to learn, figure this out...get a dyno tune.

I love the controle this sucker has, just wish I had everything sorted out on my end. Plus the knowledge from learning is nice once you get things going.

mo_dingo · Oct 10, 2005

If you aren't going to add more parts later, then a chip is good. But if you have big plans for the car, you should look into a tweecer or PMS.
Scott

final5-0 · Oct 10, 2005

Maybe this can help you decide.

Here is a ball park investment figure to have a complete self tuning setup with using the Tweecer interface.

Tweecer interface 550
Wide Band 200 to 400
Laptop 100 to 400
Misc software 50

Sad thing about it is ...........................

this option is just about the smallest investment you can make for a complete self tuning setup which, btw, includes a very nice datalogging feature.

Any other self tuning option I've seen that offers the same features is substantially more costly.

For the cost savings, you do need to supply an effort to learn about the basic workings of the pcm and performance tuning.

Grady

greenlantern · Oct 10, 2005

The PMS is easier to use than the tweecer so if I had to choose between the two it would be the PMS. That being said your still gonna need the wideband to get it right. Add that to the much more expensive PMS and your back into the same kinda money as the above scenario.

I say do the custom burned chip and be done with it.

1994Vib.RedGT · Oct 11, 2005

What is the usual going rate for custom chips? and im assuming you mean wideband 02 sensors when you refer to wideband?

Grn92LX · Oct 11, 2005

Im in my tuning devices for a total of $775. I got my anderson PMS used for $410 shipped and I got my brand new innovate motorsports LM 1 with rpm converter kit for a hook-up price of $365. The going rate for a chip in my area is $600+. Remember, thats a one shot deal. A self tuning device will make it a LOT easier to fix your idle and driveability gremelins since you can make changes on the spot. I vote pms or tweecer.

GRGT1994 · Oct 11, 2005

Correct me if I'm wrong on this guys, but a dyno tune (chip or otherwise) only addresses engine tuning at WOT. So it does nothing for driveability issues.

If I'm right on that, you might want to go with a tweecer or PMS AND a dyno tune (at a shop that can work with whichever tuner you choose). Man it's easy spending other people's money.

Methodical · Oct 11, 2005

TwEECer. Control Baby Control!!!!!!!!!

Zero Signal · Oct 11, 2005

Yeah a dyno tune won't do crap for your driveability or any other problems you might have. Unless those guys do all of that too, which I thought they didn't.

final5-0 · Oct 11, 2005

GRGT1994 said:
Correct me if I'm wrong on this guys, but a dyno tune (chip or otherwise) only addresses engine tuning at WOT. So it does nothing for driveability issues.

If I'm right on that, you might want to go with a tweecer or PMS AND a dyno tune (at a shop that can work with whichever tuner you choose). Man it's easy spending other people's money.

Why would you invest in a self tuning system and then pay someone else to use YOUR system to tune YOUR car?

Grady

20new5.0 · Oct 11, 2005

do you guys know of any mail order tunes?

stevinwayne · Oct 11, 2005

Zero Signal said:
Yeah a dyno tune won't do crap for your driveability or any other problems you might have. Unless those guys do all of that too, which I thought they didn't.

yes they do, any decent tuner will fix all driveability issues as well as make more power top end....

you guys just are so blind by the tweecer... sure it's a good product, but i don't get caught up in the hype. 500+ dollars for the tweecer, then the wide band, then then you need a laptop, with xp pro.

or drive, or trailor your car to a tuner, pay the 350 dollars then dyno time. somewhere under 500 bucks and you can have a car that runs well and makes power. for even cheaper than the price of a tweecer alone.

AND on top of that, you have no learning curve to worry about as well as a trained professional WHO KNOWS what he his doing tuning your car.

now if you plan on adding parts later, you can go back to the tuning shop, and i've heard of them working a deal with you. but for me when i did my combo, i did it all at once none of the, lets install this, and then hopefully later on i can add heads to the combo. I tried to plan ahead enough so that i have a fully built long block ready to drop in then go to the tune shop. i don't want to have to guess around and then wonder if it'll work with my other mods and have to worry about a tune, i like to get it all out of the way at once.

/end rant

1994Vib.RedGT · Oct 11, 2005

why would you need to dyno tune even after buying a tweecer?? as well, why do they only make the cheaper handhelds for OBD II cars?

blksn955.o · Oct 11, 2005

stevinwayne said:
yes they do, any decent tuner will fix all driveability issues as well as make more power top end....

you guys just are so blind by the tweecer... sure it's a good product, but i don't get caught up in the hype. 500+ dollars for the tweecer, then the wide band, then then you need a laptop, with xp pro.

or drive, or trailor your car to a tuner, pay the 350 dollars then dyno time. somewhere under 500 bucks and you can have a car that runs well and makes power. for even cheaper than the price of a tweecer alone.

AND on top of that, you have no learning curve to worry about as well as a trained professional WHO KNOWS what he his doing tuning your car.

now if you plan on adding parts later, you can go back to the tuning shop, and i've heard of them working a deal with you. but for me when i did my combo, i did it all at once none of the, lets install this, and then hopefully later on i can add heads to the combo. I tried to plan ahead enough so that i have a fully built long block ready to drop in then go to the tune shop. i don't want to have to guess around and then wonder if it'll work with my other mods and have to worry about a tune, i like to get it all out of the way at once.

/end rant

YOU only need a laptop with usb and windows 98 or newer, AKA any cheap arse laptop on ebay for around 150-200 max.

That "knows what they are doing" is the hard part to find in ALOT of cities. There are so many diff. computers that work with so many diff. types of programs that are very diff. ex. speed density, 88-93 MAF cars, 94-95 load based 5.0 MAF cars, 96-98 obdII load based 4.6 cars, 99+ obdII cars.

Even with a avg. to slighlty above avg. tuner you run the very real possibility of needing a re-tune for drivability issues that pop up.

I realy dont think there is a NON-PITFA way to go, either you run the risk of depending on someone else to tune your car and possibly needing to be dependant on going back, or go threw the learning curve stuff.

Me, if my stuff is going to blow up I sure as hell want it to be 100% my fault and not someone who is going to say sorry and more than likely something I will still have to pay for.

blksn955.o · Oct 11, 2005

1994Vib.RedGT said:
why would you need to dyno tune even after buying a tweecer?? as well, why do they only make the cheaper handhelds for OBD II cars?

Basicly to find out what tune makes those extra 3-5hp on a dyno and if you dont want to buy a wideband to check and make sure your commanded A/F is what your inputing into the tweecer. If you can find a dyno that will work with you for just pulls, stop buy and talk to them and explain what your doing, you can get some good prices on dyno time.

The biggest advantage to tuning on the street is that all the loads and driving conditions in the real world like stop and go traffic, taking off from hills, low load bucking, ect. can be cought in a datalog and looked at to solve the issue.

BlownFiveLiter · Oct 11, 2005

blksn955.o said:
Me, if my stuff is going to blow up I sure as hell want it to be 100% my fault and not someone who is going to say sorry and more than likely something I will still have to pay for.

Agreed. I'd rather blow it up myself with my bad tune than with someone else's. That's not to mention anytime you find a small issue with the tune, having to take the time to go back to the "expert" tuner, who more than likely is a nice cruise away. If you do it correctly yourself, you get the satisfaction and knowledge of a job well done, which IMO goes a lot farther than dropping money on the table everytime you have an issue. You can fix your own issues for a lot less over time, than repeated trips to the dyno.

VibrantRedGT · Oct 11, 2005

If you go to www.stangtuning.com and browse the classifieds you can find deals on the PMS for 94-95's under $700. I bought mine for $500 which was never used. I had the Tweecer and although the datalogging feature ruled it was pretty overwhelming for me. I didn't have the time for it. Some people really dig it (Grady comes to mind). Seems the dyno shops around here are familiar with the PMS over the Tweecer. I like the hand held unit rather then a laptop. It's personal choice at this point. Now if your completely done with mods then a custom burned chip is the way to go. If you make changes to your combo then the chip is pretty useless.

tune or tweecer?

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