What do I have for a Mass Air Meter?
- Thread starter cjhenry01
- Start date
poneypower89
Now everyone in the world will know I wanna bang t
Umm... are you saying all you have is the C&L tube itself and you dont actually know what ur mass air meter is?
If you dont actually have a C&L MASS AIR METER to go along with that tube.. then that tube is currently worthless.
If im reading this right then you probably have the stock MAF calburated to 19# injectors
If you dont actually have a C&L MASS AIR METER to go along with that tube.. then that tube is currently worthless.
If im reading this right then you probably have the stock MAF calburated to 19# injectors
poneypower89
Now everyone in the world will know I wanna bang t
Ok.. im reading this some more..
You could be mistaking the C&L tube for the mass air meter itself. C&L meters reuse the stock electronics so of course it will say "FORD" on it. C&L meters re-caliburate injector sizes by "sample tubes" which are very small tubes that slide into the C&L meter istelf and over the stock MAF element.. does any of this make sense?
You could be mistaking the C&L tube for the mass air meter itself. C&L meters reuse the stock electronics so of course it will say "FORD" on it. C&L meters re-caliburate injector sizes by "sample tubes" which are very small tubes that slide into the C&L meter istelf and over the stock MAF element.. does any of this make sense?
Anyone?
I also have a cobra computer and I want to verify if I have the correct mass air meter in my car. I don't think the prior owner knew what he was doing when he did the mass air conversion on my 88 gt. Any suggestions on how I can check the C&L to see if it's the right one?
Thanks much!!!
I also have a cobra computer and I want to verify if I have the correct mass air meter in my car. I don't think the prior owner knew what he was doing when he did the mass air conversion on my 88 gt. Any suggestions on how I can check the C&L to see if it's the right one?
Thanks much!!!
C&L meters use a small sample tube that mounts on the upper portion of the MAF tube. The size of the small sample tube MUST correspond to the size of the fuel injectors.
The MAS (mass air Sensor) is the black electronics that bolts to the top of the MAF. This should be interchangeable between the A9L and X3Z computers.
I have to call C&L on this subject myself so I will let you know what they say.
What you need to do is look at the color coding on the exit side of the sample tube inside the MAF. The color of the tube will correspond to the size of injector with your computer.
The C&L application chart can be found here.
http://www.cnlperformance.com/calibration.html
Good Luck
jason
The MAS (mass air Sensor) is the black electronics that bolts to the top of the MAF. This should be interchangeable between the A9L and X3Z computers.
I have to call C&L on this subject myself so I will let you know what they say.
What you need to do is look at the color coding on the exit side of the sample tube inside the MAF. The color of the tube will correspond to the size of injector with your computer.
The C&L application chart can be found here.
http://www.cnlperformance.com/calibration.html
Good Luck
jason
cjhenry01 said:
Unfortunately a Clear tube (as C&L calls a sample tube with NO color code), has very little meaning. The clear tube is correct for a A9L, 73mm MAF, and 19lb injector. However since the color marking can be removed so easily, a tube without color must be verified as appropriate.
I have been doing a fair amount of research on this subject the last few days, and here are the potential problems for you.
1. You need to verify that the MAS (just the black electronics box) is correct for a 93 Cobra. I was wrong when I stated that the A9L and X3Z MAS were the same. They are different due to the 93 Cobra having a 70mm MAF, and the A9L having a 55mm MAF. I will go out to the car in a few miutes and provide my part number as I have a cobra MAF. it may be best to call a Ford dealer to verify this though, as Ford has been known to change part numbers from time to time. Or, check here.
http://www.motorcraft.com/default.jsp
2. You do not know if your sample tube is correct for your C&L meter & Injector combo. Since there is no color coding on the back end of your tube you will need to measure it. A pair of calipers will do the trick. I have a list of common (on Mustangs anyway) C&L sample tubes listed with inlet and outlet diameters, on my website.
http://www.freewebs.com/vristang/clsampletubes.htm
Let me know if you have more questions
jason
GT_Rich
Member
?
I once read that 93 Cobras are an odd ball b/c they use a mass air meter calibrated for 19# injectors, but have a computer internally calibrated for 24#injectors.
I recently picked up a 93 Cobra 70mm MAF and run it on my car with 19# injectors and I have zero problems. I think this should prove what I just typed.
I would think that even though you are running 24# injectors, since you have a Cobra computer, you'd need a 19# sampling tube? That's just a guess though.
I once read that 93 Cobras are an odd ball b/c they use a mass air meter calibrated for 19# injectors, but have a computer internally calibrated for 24#injectors.
I recently picked up a 93 Cobra 70mm MAF and run it on my car with 19# injectors and I have zero problems. I think this should prove what I just typed.
I would think that even though you are running 24# injectors, since you have a Cobra computer, you'd need a 19# sampling tube? That's just a guess though.
txstang84
15 Year Member
you should have a black tube if you're using the X3Z computer, 73mm C&L and 24lb'ers according to the C&L calibration page, furthermore, it says a clear tube is for a '93 Cobra ECM with supercharger (?) wierd...anyway, hope that helps
GT_Rich said:
Others have reported the same thing, but the idea is that this is not an ideal solution. And the combo that you are using is a 70mm MAS on a 70mm MAF, which shouldn't be too bad.
The problem is that when the hardware is not matched (computer, MAF, MAS, Injector), the software will have to dip into its adaptive strategies in order to hit the proper fuel mixtures. I had all of my hardware matched (according to C&L), but when I picked up the TwEECer and started Datalogging I found out that under certain circumstances, I had maxed out the adaptive ability in my EEC; ~12%. That meant that under those conditions, I would never hit the proper a/f mixture.
Michael Yount posted a better explanation in this thread... http://forums.stangnet.com/showthread.php?t=618038
And here is another thread that explains things fairly well.
http://forums.stangnet.com/showthread.php?t=619654
Good Luck with the Stangs,
jason
txstang84
15 Year Member
vristang said:
Ok, I verfied the following:
1: X3Z Computer (93 Cobra Computer)
2: Mass Air Meter Part # F1ZF-12B579-AA which is for a 5.0 Liter Mustang
(Not the 93 Cobra Coputer which is # F1SZ-12B579-A)
3: 73mm C & L MAF (With clear sample tube, but I think it's missing the color code)
I measured it and the Inlet Diameter is .6500" & Outlet Diameter is .5550"
I determined by these measurements that it's the blue sample tube which is for 24# injectors.
Isn't the X3Z computer designed to work with 24# injectors, a 93 Cobra MAS (Mass Air Sensor-Black Electronics Box), and a MAF that's calibrated or designed to work with 19# injectors as it adjusts the calibration internally from 19# to 24#?
If this is correct, than Is my setup messed up?
cjhenry01 said:
Just to make sure I have things straight...
Your combo
X3Z / 73mm C&L / Blue Sample Tube / 24lb Inj / 5.0HO MAS
The only potential for trouble here is the 5.0HO MAS. The question is
"Is the 5.0HO MAS interchangeable with the 93 Cobra MAS?"
I have thought I had the "right" answer several times, but keep finding contradictory info.
If you search for an MAS on the Schucks site it pulls up both the Cobra and HO MAS.
And there are several OE number listed for each application.
The Ford site I listed above has been a waste of time, because it only looks up ford part numbers not the OE numbers.
On my car (which I think was converted to a Cobra MAS) the MAS number is as follows...
F1SF-12B579-AA-AFH70-02
1C05 (maybe that is a 1005 though)
I am just as eager as you to find the answer to this question, as I am in the same situation.
My next attempt will be to call Ford.
I'll let you know what I figure out, if anything.
jason
GT_Rich
Member
that's not good
Dangit - the cobra maf probably isn't safe to be running in my car then, is it? I guess I should have done more hw before buying one.
Question, since I already have it: Would I be able to pick up a 94-95 maf and swap the electronics over to my housing instead of using the 94-95 housing and having to get a flange adapter?
Thanks,
Dangit - the cobra maf probably isn't safe to be running in my car then, is it? I guess I should have done more hw before buying one.
Question, since I already have it: Would I be able to pick up a 94-95 maf and swap the electronics over to my housing instead of using the 94-95 housing and having to get a flange adapter?
Thanks,
GT_Rich said:
As of right now, I have no idea what is interchangeable and what isn't. There are just too many differing answers to these questions.
The Ford Tech Line is closed til Tuesday. I'll give them a call and let you guys know what I find out.
jason
GT_Rich
Member
thanks
Jason,
I forgot to thank you in my last post for the info you've contributed to this thread. You have definitely saved me a potentially dangerous lean WOT condition. I'll be swapping in my old 55mm unit tomorrow until I can figure something else out.
The reason I think a 94-95 sensor could be swapped into a 93 cobra housing is b/c they are both 70 mm housings and I *assume* have the same diameter tubes in them. I can measure mine with calipers next week and compare with someone who has a 94-95 unit to verify this. So if the housings are geometrically consistent, then swapping in the 94-95 sensor would give me the correct transfer function without having to deal with the flange on the other maf.
Keep us posted on what you find out from Ford tech.
Jason,
I forgot to thank you in my last post for the info you've contributed to this thread. You have definitely saved me a potentially dangerous lean WOT condition. I'll be swapping in my old 55mm unit tomorrow until I can figure something else out.
The reason I think a 94-95 sensor could be swapped into a 93 cobra housing is b/c they are both 70 mm housings and I *assume* have the same diameter tubes in them. I can measure mine with calipers next week and compare with someone who has a 94-95 unit to verify this. So if the housings are geometrically consistent, then swapping in the 94-95 sensor would give me the correct transfer function without having to deal with the flange on the other maf.
Keep us posted on what you find out from Ford tech.
GT_Rich
Member
ttt
Jason - any new news on this topic?
After some part number searching of my own, I found that what I actually bought off ebay is a 70mm 93 Cobra MAF housing with a 87-93 sensor (the sensors that come stock on the 55mm units). Anyone have any insight on that combo? The ebay seller is swearing by it and claims "he runs it in all his customer's cars." It just doesn't seem like it should work and produce a safe A/F ratio, does it?
Thanks,
Rich
Jason - any new news on this topic?
After some part number searching of my own, I found that what I actually bought off ebay is a 70mm 93 Cobra MAF housing with a 87-93 sensor (the sensors that come stock on the 55mm units). Anyone have any insight on that combo? The ebay seller is swearing by it and claims "he runs it in all his customer's cars." It just doesn't seem like it should work and produce a safe A/F ratio, does it?
Thanks,
Rich
