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  • Fox 5.0 Mustang Tech

What Should I Rev Too?

  • Thread starter Thread starter vpap1
  • Start date Start date Jun 24, 2012
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Noobz347

Stangnet Facilities Maint Tech... Er... Janitor
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#21
  • Jun 25, 2012
  • #21
Concentrate on the ignition system. Concentrate on making it PERFECT and see if you don't stumble onto the problem while in the process.
 

5.0Droptop

...all those nights we shared, and you're a dude??
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#22
  • Jun 25, 2012
  • #22
Mustang dyno or dyno jet?
 
V

vpap1

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#23
  • Jun 25, 2012
  • #23
5.0Droptop said:
Mustang dyno or dyno jet?
Click to expand...
dyno jet
 
V

vpap1

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#24
  • Jun 25, 2012
  • #24
if i need a new distrib would a reman stocker with an upgraded tfi and upgraded coil handle nitrous duty and or a turbo in the future? to the tune of 525-550hp at the fly, just so i dont have to upgrade again later?
 

Noobz347

Stangnet Facilities Maint Tech... Er... Janitor
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#25
  • Jun 25, 2012
  • #25
vpap1 said:
if i need a new distrib would a reman stocker with an upgraded tfi and upgraded coil handle nitrous duty and or a turbo in the future? to the tune of 525-550hp at the fly, just so i dont have to upgrade again later?
Click to expand...

I run those numbers on a stock ignition system with a stock coil and boost-A-Spark on Taylor wires with an MSD cap and rotor.
 
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vpap1

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#26
  • Jun 25, 2012
  • #26
do you think i require a igniton box?
 

Noobz347

Stangnet Facilities Maint Tech... Er... Janitor
Admin Dude
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#27
  • Jun 25, 2012
  • #27
vpap1 said:
do you think i require a igniton box?
Click to expand...

I don't believe in em, for the most part. All it does it take your long duration fat spark and replace with short duration skinny one. Multi-sparks only last until 3000 rpm. So you'd get no benefit up top.

What I think you need is to find the problem with your current ignition system.
 

srtthis

the guy doing it does every local racers rear end
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#28
  • Jun 25, 2012
  • #28
I'm going to disagree with noobz here... Running an MSD box on it would be wise if your running nitrous or even a turbo. Turn the factory rev limiter to say 9999 and control the limit on the box. Factory limiter cuts fuel not spark msd box cuts spark. You go cutting fuel on a nitrous car if you tap the limiter with it on it will go KABOOM
 

5.0Droptop

...all those nights we shared, and you're a dude??
Special Agent Mukity-Muck Whats in Charge Round Here
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#29
  • Jun 25, 2012
  • #29
vpap1 said:
dyno jet
Click to expand...
oh. Those are low numbers for a 347 on a dynojet.

My buddy was down about 100 horse on his 347. It was almost identical to mine. Turned out the timing chain marks were not dot to dot it was a tooth or two off and caused the power loss.
 
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vpap1

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#30
  • Jun 25, 2012
  • #30
5.0Droptop said:
oh. Those are low numbers for a 347 on a dynojet.

My buddy was down about 100 horse on his 347. It walmost identical to mine. Turned out the timing chain marks were not dot to dot it was a tooth or two off and caused the power loss.
Click to expand...
I deff have stalled dot to dot- the distrib looks a tooth off though would this cause such a loss?
 

5.0Droptop

...all those nights we shared, and you're a dude??
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#31
  • Jun 25, 2012
  • #31
vpap1 said:
I deff have stalled dot to dot- the distrib looks a tooth off though would this cause such a loss?
Click to expand...

Ive read here on stangnet that the tooth off on the dizzy is kinda BS because as long as you can turn the dizzy enough to set the timing then it dont matter. I have a particular way that i stab the dizzy on the 302's i have done. I never had one a tooth off so i cant say for certian if it really matters.
 

f8tlfiveo

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#32
  • Jun 26, 2012
  • #32
5.0Droptop said:
Ive read here on stangnet that the tooth off on the dizzy is kinda BS because as long as you can turn the dizzy enough to set the timing then it dont matter.
Click to expand...
I agree.. As long as you can turn the distributor far enough you are fine..if you could spin the dizzy 360 deg you could just throw it in and turn it till you got what you wanted..
 

Noobz347

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#33
  • Jun 26, 2012
  • #33
srtthis said:
I'm going to disagree with noobz here... Running an MSD box on it would be wise if your running nitrous or even a turbo. Turn the factory rev limiter to say 9999 and control the limit on the box. Factory limiter cuts fuel not spark msd box cuts spark. You go cutting fuel on a nitrous car if you tap the limiter with it on it will go KABOOM
Click to expand...

That's cool... I know that there are folks out there who have had a lot of success with an aftermarket box and swear by them. For me, thye've been mostly hype and not a lot of function. For the OP though... He's got a problem that will likely not be solved by blindly tossing parts at it. Were I the OP and my problem were sluggish throttle response, breaking up under boost off-idle, or intermittent power loss/backfires, I might suggest a multi-spark to fix a weak ignition.

This problem here though.... sounds like the various pieces and parts are not up the task or worn out. I also suspect (just a suspicion) that the coil is not being saturated. Maybe from either a bad ground or low voltage. Another suspicion is that the TFI might be a knock off or that the PiP is in it's golden years not firing in perfect time.

All suspicions and no way to way to tell without standing infront of it. I haven't seen much that the OEM ignition system can't do on street driven vehicle running pump gas.
 

89stang1

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#34
  • Jun 26, 2012
  • #34
i agree with all noobz347 last comments exept the ignition box.....im still going with tfi or pip cause ive been thru both more than once, do you have a code reader? that showed me the way to a bad pip or just buy one of each and swap cause you should have a spare in glovebox with these cars anyway. Good luck hope u find the power btw my car made 364rwhp and 385rwt corrected on a very stingy mustang dyno (actual numbers before correction were 382rwhp 402rwt) with a small intake making power only to 5500rpms, so there might be some power loss with those heads
 
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vpap1

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#35
  • Jun 26, 2012
  • #35
89stang1 said:
i agree with all noobz347 last comments exept the ignition box.....im still going with tfi or pip cause ive been thru both more than once, do you have a code reader? that showed me the way to a bad pip or just buy one of each and swap cause you should have a spare in glovebox with these cars anyway. Good luck hope u find the power btw my car made 364rwhp and 385rwt corrected on a very stingy mustang dyno (actual numbers before correction were 382rwhp 402rwt) with a small intake, so there might be some power loss with those heads
Click to expand...
thanks guys i will work on diagnosing the tfi pip and coil, and check all the basics an go from there. The other most brought up issue could be vavle springs but i dont believe that ... yet
 

2000xp8

SN Certified Technician
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Jun 26, 2012
#36
  • Jun 26, 2012
  • #36
srtthis said:
I'm going to disagree with noobz here... Running an MSD box on it would be wise if your running nitrous or even a turbo. Turn the factory rev limiter to say 9999 and control the limit on the box. Factory limiter cuts fuel not spark msd box cuts spark. You go cutting fuel on a nitrous car if you tap the limiter with it on it will go KABOOM
Click to expand...

You are talking about two different uses for an msd box, it's one thing to want it as a limiter, but for performance gains or repairing a spark issue, they are useless.
 

2000xp8

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#37
  • Jun 26, 2012
  • #37
Noobz347 said:
Another suspicion is that the TFI might be a knock off or that the PiP is in it's golden years not firing in perfect time.

All suspicions and no way to way to tell without standing infront of it. I haven't seen much that the OEM ignition system can't do on street driven vehicle running pump gas.
Click to expand...
Agreed, the stock ignition will support pretty much anything you can throw at it.
I believe he said somewhere above he had a dyno module or similar for a TFI, which i can pretty much say for sure is a POS, they are all crap except the original ford.
 
V

vpap1

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#38
  • Jun 26, 2012
  • #38
2000xp8 said:
Agreed, the stock ignition will support pretty much anything you can throw at it.
I believe he said somewhere above he had a dyno module or similar for a TFI, which i can pretty much say for sure is a POS, they are all crap except the original ford.
Click to expand...
how do you feel about a aftermarket coil?
 

srtthis

the guy doing it does every local racers rear end
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#39
  • Jun 26, 2012
  • #39
2000xp8 said:
You are talking about two different uses for an msd box, it's one thing to want it as a limiter, but for performance gains or repairing a spark issue, they are useless.
Click to expand...

vpap1 said:
if i need a new distrib would a reman stocker with an upgraded tfi and upgraded coil handle nitrous duty and or a turbo in the future? to the tune of 525-550hp at the fly, just so i dont have to upgrade again later?
Click to expand...
that statement alone for me is enough to put an MSD in box for me. i personaly dont like how the factory computer does the limiter.
 

Noobz347

Stangnet Facilities Maint Tech... Er... Janitor
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#40
  • Jun 26, 2012
  • #40
srtthis said:
that statement alone for me is enough to put an MSD in box for me. i personaly dont like how the factory computer does the limiter.
Click to expand...

You're a wet nitrous guy though, right?
 
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