what type of heads?

[white99gt]

Dude I'm confused here...you say the car was already HCI with a shorty exhaust? So are those gains from switching TO longtubes or are they from switching TO Shorties?

I find it hard to believe that everyone in the high performance industry uses long tubes...i wonder why they would do that if the cheaper and easier to instal shorties made more power...substantially more power?

Already was a H/c/I car with shorties/tuned etc..The ONLY thing changed was going TO longtubes.

Most run shorties due to emissions,fitament,hassles,heat etc..Sometimes cost due to already having some parts already on the car.


You dont see factory stock cars running shorties..

 

[Daggar]

I wonder how that would all factor in against my 1 3/4 Bassani shorties. What I mean is... there's a marked improvement with these over the 1 5/8 on combination that make use of the extra room. I wonder how that improvement would stack against that of a longtube on the same combo.

 

[5spd GT]

Congrats on the gains, seriously.

I have never seen a gain like that from shorties to longtubes, even when the cam events are for longtubes...

I have seen back to back gains in the low/mid region gain, and have seen consistent gains around .05-.1 on there E.T.

I gained 1.3mph with a fresh rebuild (more compression), ported lower by tmoss, and BBK longtubes...over 162k bottomend/regular performer lower/ and smashed in Mac 1 5/8"...

When I look at the two types of headers, I see the same primary size, but a bit different exhaust orientation...now is it worth 30hp...I don't think so, but I think gains can be made...

Is it worth it? That is up to the owner to decide

Thanks for posting that...

 

[white99gt]

I wonder how that would all factor in against my 1 3/4 Bassani shorties. What I mean is... there's a marked improvement with these over the 1 5/8 on combination that make use of the extra room. I wonder how that improvement would stack against that of a longtube on the same combo.

It would be nice to see a dyno compairson (real world not some dam magazine test)..
But the only bad thing is not every combo is the same,even the same parts on a different (shortblock) engine will run different.

5spd gt -no problem on the posts.I can tell you i was more shocked than anyone else.I knew it picked up power but figured it was only 10~15rwhp at the MOST...

car has not been to the track but is quick enough to beat a friends 2003 audi rs6 on the highway ..

 

[5spd GT]

It would be nice to see a dyno compairson (real world not some dam magazine test)..
But the only bad thing is not every combo is the same,even the same parts on a different (shortblock) engine will run different.

5spd gt -no problem on the posts.I can tell you i was more shocked than anyone else.I knew it picked up power but figured it was only 10~15rwhp at the MOST...

car has not been to the track but is quick enough to beat a friends 2003 audi rs6 on the highway ..

I haven't seen any magazine dyno testing, I'm sure they have them out there though. I have seen stangers post dyno graphs and seen gains in the low-mid range, but very similar power in the upper range (where most cars are racing at). Cammin2v on the corral posted his shorty to longtube swap and showed that very thing. He told me he gained a consistent .05 off his E.T...

 

[andrewsg]

I do not have a dyno sheet to post, but from a past setup; I had 1 3/4 inch equal length shorties and then 1 3/4 longtubes and the power i gained was 18rwhp and 26rwtq.

Go figure. Everything else was the same -- except for the fact that the shorties had a flowmaster setup with dumps while the longtubes had dynomax bullets installed infront of the flowmaster dumps for a total of 4 mufflers.

Maybe the bullets helped increase hp too? Who knows I would think adding an extra 2 mufflers in line of the exhaust would lose power not make it.

Regards,
G

 

[Daggar]

Well 18 HP is nothing to sneeze at, for sure. Thanks for the comparison.

 

[andrewsg]

Ya no issue -- whats strange is -- on the thumper setup I had, I changed from shorties into longtubes (feeding into a Y pipe to feed the T6/101mm) and I saw 38rwhp, 44rwtq in difference. So talk about flow difference, there definitely is one.

I wish I had the ability to post up my sheets, but I dont have a scanner nor a camera. But If I did -- man, I'd probably have a gig worth of timeslips, build photos, dyno sheets, lists, etc.

Hah.

Regards,
Gered

 

[andrewsg]

Oh yeah -- :OT:

Daggar -- your car looks real clean -- what hood is that (yeah I know PMs are for this sorta question but I never check them). I have an 86 nitrous fed vert. Everyone in my area hates four-eyes. Conversion asshats -- if you want an aero, buy one, leave the four-eyes alone.

Regards,
Gered

 

[jmanga85]

go with afr 185 cc heads,these are incredible, i have a buddy that bought 'em and he says they were the best out therefor a mild to strong street set up.Also they're great for forced induction.

 

[2000xp8]

go with afr 185 cc heads,these are incredible, i have a buddy that bought 'em and he says they were the best out therefor a mild to strong street set up.Also they're great for forced induction.

Nothing personal, but you say they are incredible, then proceed to say your buddy told you they are the best. Hearsay is not good for $1300 heads.

BTW, they are not the best for a NA 302.

 

[5spd GT]

There is no best for a N/A anything

 

[Foxfan88]

there is no BEST head for say a street thing. every car is different. its all up to what the builder wants to engine to do and how its going to act and what sort of driving its going to do.

i'd take a well built, mild iron head combo that runs good over an engine that has just BIG HUGE VALVE ALUM HEADS that flow 344546 cfm, and nothing else to support it.

too many times have there been people spending all their money on an expensive set of cyl heads thinking thats where the powers at and buy cheap and mis matched parts to go with it.

what they get is a car with POOR drivability, doggy low end and a mediocre powerband. the heads can flow but once the rpms just get to where the heads really start chugging the rest of the mismatched parts are throwing in the towel and are done making power.

as for the original post. the E-cam, gt-40 or equivalent intake and some eddy performer heads. would be a nice running street combo if you dont have the cash for the alum heads invest in iron, a nicely ported set of gt40s flow similar to edelbrock alum heads.

 

[white99gt]

there is no BEST head for say a street thing. every car is different. its all up to what the builder wants to engine to do and how its going to act and what sort of driving its going to do.

i'd take a well built, mild iron head combo that runs good over an engine that has just BIG HUGE VALVE ALUM HEADS that flow 344546 cfm, and nothing else to support it.

too many times have there been people spending all their money on an expensive set of cyl heads thinking thats where the powers at and buy cheap and mis matched parts to go with it.

what they get is a car with POOR drivability, doggy low end and a mediocre powerband. the heads can flow but once the rpms just get to where the heads really start chugging the rest of the mismatched parts are throwing in the towel and are done making power.

as for the original post. the E-cam, gt-40 or equivalent intake and some eddy performer heads. would be a nice running street combo if you dont have the cash for the alum heads invest in iron, a nicely ported set of gt40s flow similar to edelbrock alum heads.

I agree on this 100%..I could have went with a of of bigger parts,and made a lot more top end power..But for a TRUE street car the gt40/cobra/explorer stuff with a good set of heads is hard to pass up..I run that combo tmoss ported explorer with eddy heads,i love it.

Check out tmoss site : lot of info on there.
www.tmossporting.com

 

[andrewsg]

I agree with what y'all are saying -- to each combo its own.

I have found it is always best to work with a goal in mind first. Then move on. Usually people can't do it all at once and they try to do it in stages. Which in some cases does not really leave you with much of a choice; you either have to go for it all and or half ass it. And if you go for it all at that point in time you end up with a poorly performing car for daily driving but then you romp on it and it opens up and goes nuts.

I usually try to go all out if I can afford it, and If i cannot I try to work with custom parts/customizing the parts I already have; to expunge the most performance possible from what I already have.

A carb setup is somewhat less finnicky than a EFI setup when it comes to N/A combos.

But that is just my experience with the 14 foxes that Ive had.

Such is life.

To each their own but good luck to all and hopefully everyone gets what they want out of their cars without having to make themselves poor and unhappy.