Yellow brick road to a great Suspension

iamadonut said:

Is it worth it to get roller perches but still use OEM arms?
On the same note, is it worth it to get new bushings but still use OEM arms?

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Yes and yes. The OEM arms are functional, even if they're not oh-so-cool. They serve the same purpose as expensive tubular arms. The big benefits to aftermarket tubular arms is their ability to incorporate better ball joint angle allowing for lowering and more negative camber. They're also supposed to be more durable. Some are designed to allow for using coil-overs. Otherwise, adding other components like roller perches and poly bushings is perfectly functional with OEM arms.

BTW, did you get to read the stuff I posted? Was it helpful? Just curious...

'70 spindles are heavy duty unless the car has been hit in the front your fine

67p51d is right on. Unless the spindles are damaged, go ahead and reuse them. They're the heaviest spindles used on vintage Mustangs, and I've never heard of anyone frag'ing one, so you can probably feel pretty confident about them.

iamadonut said:

Here's a follow-up question...I know R&P steering is over $1k, but those are all manual steering systems, right? Are there any power R&P systems that will fit without any heavy modifcation to the car? If R&P is too expensive, what do you suggest is the next best thing? Rebuilding the stock system or upgrading to ???

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There are power R&P kits available. One is from TCP, the other from Randall's Rack - available at Mustangs Depot.

My alternative is to install a KRC pump with a flow control valve to a stock P/S system. My hope is to fine-tune the steering by varying the flow to the control valve. I picked up the pump, resevoir, and steel braided lines from ebay for ~$150. I will need to make up some custom high pressure hydraulic lines and I'm set. Engine, Tranny, and Suspension should be done in late September. I'll post results when completed.

The stock steering is never going to feel like r&p, but it can be perform pretty well with a good rebuild and some modifications. The thing to remember is that the steering system is indeed a system. It has several components that can all contribute to lousy feel and response. A good suspension rebuild with new tie rods and idler arm can make a good bit of difference. Beyond that, if you've got power steering, rebuilding those components is a must. Next would either be a steering box rebuild or a new box from Flaming River. You might also consider a roller bearing kit for the idler arm (from Cobra Automotive), and the Shelby quick steer kit if you've got manual steering. I've heard really good things about both of those.

Here is how I would proceed... first, climb under the car and have someone turn the wheel and watch for spots in the system where there is flex or looseness. I found the bushing on my idler arm was worn and was allowing over an inch of steering wheel movement before wheels started moving. I replaced that bushing with a custom poly bushing and was immediately rewarded with better steering response.

Next, I would adjust the steering box. Consult the Ford manual or a Haynes manual for the procedure. I will say there is the "correct" way and the basic "good enough" way. I chose the latter and haven't had any problems. This also took out another 1/2 inch of steering wheel play. I now have about 3/4 inch of wheel play, which isn't bad at all.

My next project is getting some feel back to the stock power steering system. I've already added the polyurethane rag joint in the steering couple, plus poly bushing throughout the system and suspension have helped. But I've been planning on adding an adjustable pressure control valve like 66P51GT mentioned. There was an article in Fabulous Fords magazine back in the early '90s (or was it the late '80s?) that showed how to do this. I'm actually surprised no magazine has repeated this since. By all accounts it made a significant difference in the amount of feel added back to the system. Makes me think all those aftermarket suspension/steering companies are conspiring with the magazines to get us to buy their stuff rather than giving us inexpensive DIY options. Hell, it seems every tech article in Mustang and Fords is nothing but big ad for some company's product.

Anyway, hope this helps a bit...

DarkBuddha said:

But I've been planning on adding an adjustable pressure control valve like 66P51GT mentioned. There was an article in Fabulous Fords magazine back in the early '90s (or was it the late '80s?) that showed how to do this.

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I'd be interested to see the article. However, All I think is necessary from a DIY perspective is making the high-pressure and return hydraulic lines from the pump to the control valve to the resevoir.

I like the idea of the roller idler arm. Cobra Automotive does warn that you don't get the return to center feeleing as you do with stock rubber bushings. I'm willing to sacrifice this for better steering response. Adding caster will also help the return-to-center feeling.

Another thing to consider if you have lowered your car is to install Pro Motorsports bump steer correction kit. An added benefit is it modifies the outer tie-rod mount point to quickening steering ratio. A plus with power steering.

66P51GT said:

I'd be interested to see the article. However, All I think is necessary from a DIY perspective is making the high-pressure and return hydraulic lines from the pump to the control valve to the resevoir.

I like the idea of the roller idler arm. Cobra Automotive does warn that you don't get the return to center feeleing as you do with stock rubber bushings. I'm willing to sacrifice this for better steering response. Adding caster will also help the return-to-center feeling.

Another thing to consider if you have lowered your car is to install Pro Motorsports bump steer correction kit. An added benefit is it modifies the outer tie-rod mount point to quickening steering ratio. A plus with power steering.

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Wow, sounds like we're on the same path. I'd forgotten that bit about the roller bearing idler not returning to center. That would bug me on a street car. And I'm already planning on adding the Pro-motorsports bump steer correction kit. I'm basically trying to do everything to improve the stock system.

BTW, I was just thinking it was Mustang Illustrated that had the article. I've got it somewhere in a box at my parents' place, but I won't see them until the holidays I think. Anyway, as I recall, it wasn't very complicated; they just got a standard adjustable hydralic valve for like $15 and plumbed it in the pressure line. Simple but effective. If I ever do find the article, I'll scan it and post it for everybody.

DarkBuddha said:

Wow, sounds like we're on the same path.

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Yes it does. I'd be interested to hear how yours turns out if you get yours on teh street before me.

Anyway, as I recall, it wasn't very complicated; they just got a standard adjustable hydralic valve for like $15 and plumbed it in the pressure line. Simple but effective.

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I didn't know these were available. If I didn't need to replace my power steering pump, I would have gone this route.