Are Pony Cars Getting TOO Big?

[revhead347]

Ok, you guys are missing the point. The point is that a bigger vehicle does not necessarily make it more safe. In the time frame that Dateline video was made, people were buying big trucks on the assumption that they were getting something safer. In truth, you're better off in a car with a proper crumple zone. If you look at cars today, you're going to find that the heavier ones aren't necessarily the safest either. The trucks they make today have improved greatly, but still have not reached the same safety standard they have in cars. The key to surviving an accident is absorbtion in the right place, not strength. One part has to be strong, and one part has to be weak.

Kurt

 

[nmcgrawj]

Ok, you guys are missing the point. The point is that a bigger vehicle does not necessarily make it more safe. In the time frame that Dateline video was made, people were buying big trucks on the assumption that they were getting something safer. In truth, you're better off in a car with a proper crumple zone. If you look at cars today, you're going to find that the heavier ones aren't necessarily the safest either. The trucks they make today have improved greatly, but still have not reached the same safety standard they have in cars. The key to surviving an accident is absorbtion in the right place, not strength. One part has to be strong, and one part has to be weak.

Kurt

Are we arguing the safety of old trucks, or the new mustang and why its heavier?

I agree that you are better off in a vehicle with a proper crumple zone. Size alone doesnt give you safety. Size + good designs do though. This is why i will not drive a smart car on U.S. roads. I dont care how well the smart car does in crash tests....if a hummer Tbones you its not gonna be pretty. I bet the hummer passengers are fine though...maybe minor injuries.

If a F150 hits a focus from the side...its not going to be pretty for the driver. I bet the F150 passengers will be ok for the most part.



Safety needs the proper design. I dont see how u have proved that having the size HURTS you.....you only proved that bad designs hurt you. Which is obvious.

 

[revhead347]

I didn't say size hurts you, just that it is not the desiding factor in a safe vehicle.

Kurt

 

[nmcgrawj]

I didn't say size hurts you, just that it is not the desiding factor in a safe vehicle.

Kurt

There are hundreds of deciding factors in a safe vehicle. You cant just pinpoint it to one thing lol.


My example above proves it. Take a smart car. For the size they are, they have the ability to be weak in areas it needs it, and incredibly strong in others....so the passengers are "safe". But let a Hummer, Excursion, or anything else ram into it......lights out.


Size plays a role. What happens when a semi hits a car? Or a train? These are extreme examples but still....there's no way you can say size doesnt matter.



And in the mustang's case...size is a byproduct of what they have to do for the mustang to make people happy.

 

[Gearbanger 101]

And in the mustang's case...size is a byproduct of what they have to do for the mustang to make people happy.

I don't know if it’s so much to "make people happy" as it is to make the vehicle safer. I don't think there's any argument that the S197 cars are the most sturdy and safest Mustangs built to date. An unfortunate byproduct of the added safety seems to be a little added size and weight.


If the size and weight was tacked on for no go reason, I might be upset, but since the cars crash rating has improved dramatically because of it, it suits me just fine though. Especially after watching some old YouTube video's of Fox body crash tests in comparison to S197 tests. Do a search on a couple of those...they'll sober up someone’s opinion about the safety of each in a hurry.

 

[nmcgrawj]

I don't know if it’s so much to "make people happy" as it is to make the vehicle safer. I don't think there's any argument that the S197 cars are the most sturdy and safest Mustangs built to date. An unfortunate byproduct of the added safety seems to be a little added size and weight.


If the size and weight was tacked on for no go reason, I might be upset, but since the cars crash rating has improved dramatically because of it, it suits me just fine though. Especially after watching some old YouTube video's of Fox body crash tests in comparison to S197 tests. Do a search on a couple of those...they'll sober up someone’s opinion about the safety of each in a hurry.

Safety isnt the only thing. Creature comforts add weight. Go sit in a fox then sit in a s197....you're gonna experience a lot more than just a better crash rating.


For example, thicker piller steel, multiple airbags in seats, pillers, dash and steering wheel, the sensors placed all around the body to operate them, the wiring to connect them. ABS sensors, ABS modules, ABS wiring
Larger wheels with larger brake rotors and calipers, wider tires with overall larger diameters, thicker glass that reduces road noise, rubber backing on carpet to reduce road noise, larger stereos with 10-12 speakers vs the old 4, with addition of subwoofers. Larger catalytic converters, turbos, intercoolers, larger radiators, active handling modules, heated and cooled seats, etc. you can go on and on.

If you wanted to strip all that crap out, youd have yourself a 2011 cobra jet, which weighs like 700lbs less

 

[revhead347]

I'm willing to bet the S197 doesn't do any better in a crash than a 370Z, which is a comparable sports car. The 370Z performs better in every category, mainly because it is lighter and smaller. That is the target size I think the Mustang should be trying to get too. I know a lot of people who aren't satisfied with the new muscle cars, because they are just getting too big.

Kurt

 

[Black Stampede]

Just out of curiousity how many of you guys have ever purchased a vehicle due in large part to its safety ratings? Just wondering if people tend to see good safety ratings as a bonus or closer to a necessity.

 

[nmcgrawj]

I'm willing to bet the S197 doesn't do any better in a crash than a 370Z, which is a comparable sports car. The 370Z performs better in every category, mainly because it is lighter and smaller. That is the target size I think the Mustang should be trying to get too. I know a lot of people who aren't satisfied with the new muscle cars, because they are just getting too big.

Kurt

A 2 seater? Seriously? Let it go. Ford isnt building these cars just for performance.

3200-3300 lbs and its only seating half the passengers and 1/8th of the trunk space.


To keep laughing....the G37. The 370z twin. Seats 4 people.....

weight jumps up to 3600-3800lbs!


Like i said before, if you want a lightweight mustang....strip it. You'll have it. You'll lose a lot of features/comforts, but hey....it will be light!

Just out of curiousity how many of you guys have ever purchased a vehicle due in large part to its safety ratings? Just wondering if people tend to see good safety ratings as a bonus or closer to a necessity.

People in our area of interest dont....but im willing to bet those outside of it (who the company's actually build for) take it into consideration a lot more often.

 

[Black Stampede]

People in our area of interest dont....but im willing to bet those outside of it (who the company's actually build for) take it into consideration a lot more often.

Yeah thats what I would tend to agree with.

 

[xr8d302]

I contemplated taking out my side impact beams for weight savings (those things are heavy)

I didn't, but it goes to show how much safey CAN mean to a performance enthusiast.

Mention that to a regular car buyer and they'd look at you in terror

 

[revhead347]

I contemplated taking out my side impact beams for weight savings (those things are heavy)

I didn't, but it goes to show how much safey CAN mean to a performance enthusiast.

Mention that to a regular car buyer and they'd look at you in terror

If you get a cage with door bars, you can take out the side impact beams.

Kurt

 

[xr8d302]

Good thought, and I have a cage with door bars....putting it in seems like a pretty heavy task, however