Distributor Posistion

Scorcher2005 · Jul 27, 2005

i have searched the forums about dist. post when removing it for install. I am doing the h/c/i swap right now. to remove the dizzy, how do i need to mark it. i will be degreeing the cam on 108* centerline (i also dont know how to do that yet either).

MeanMussy · Jul 27, 2005

you don't need to mark the distributor if you're changing the cam.

When you're done w/ your swap, bring the #1 cyl to TDC after the compression stroke (watch the intake valve). Drop the dist in so that the rotor points at the #1 plug on the dist. That'll give you 0*BTDC. Rotate the dist a few degrees. That should put you close enough to 10*BTDC to get the thing started. Then time it.

Michael Yount · Jul 27, 2005

.....I'd add, instead of bringing #1 to tdc (compression), stop the balancer when the pointer is at the ignition timing you'd like to have -- say 14 BEFORE tdc. Then stab it like mussy says - with the rotor pointing towards #1 plug wire. That should have it close to the timing you want.

I wouldn't use the centerline to degree the cam. Use the .050" intake valve opening number off the cam card -- it's probably somewhere around 0 degrees TDC +/- 5 degrees. It's much easier to set it to that, than to accurately find the lobe centerline on the camshaft. You'll need a positive stop (screws into the spark plug hole) to accurately find TDC, and degree wheel and an stand/dial indicator to do the degree job ---- and an indexed timing gear/chain set of course.

Scorcher2005 · Jul 27, 2005

Michael Yount said:
.....I'd add, instead of bringing #1 to tdc (compression), stop the balancer when the pointer is at the ignition timing you'd like to have -- say 14 BEFORE tdc. Then stab it like mussy says - with the rotor pointing towards #1 plug wire. That should have it close to the timing you want.

I wouldn't use the centerline to degree the cam. Use the .050" intake valve opening number off the cam card -- it's probably somewhere around 0 degrees TDC +/- 5 degrees. It's much easier to set it to that, than to accurately find the lobe centerline on the camshaft. You'll need a positive stop (screws into the spark plug hole) to accurately find TDC, and degree wheel and an stand/dial indicator to do the degree job ---- and an indexed timing gear/chain set of course.

you just lost me on that explaination of the cam degree. i also forgot to get a new timing chain. im not sure of the condition of the old chain yet (obviously since the dist. isnt out), but if its good, can i still use it? If not, what set would you recommend? I see Summit brand, and comp cams for around $40 and FRPP for $65 and many others within that range.

Michael Yount · Jul 27, 2005

You can't 'degree' the cam (installing at 108 CL) unless you have some means of adjusting the cam timing - that's what an indexed timing chain set is for. If you just get a plain non-adjustable timing set, you'll only be able to install the new cam dot to dot. Which is tantamount to guessing at the cam timing.

Given the questions you're asking, I think you'll need someone that understands cam timing and degreeing to help you with this install, if you intend to install it as recommended on the cam card. I can print more detail on the degreeing process and checking piston to valve clearance if you like -- but I'm not sure it will make sense to you if you haven't done one before.

Scorcher2005 · Jul 27, 2005

i already know i will have plenty of pv clearance, im just not too sure of how to put the cam in. and the cam card is what? I have just heard of buddy rawls recommending to install the TFS stage 1 cam at 108* centerline. So i figured i would do it that way.

Michael Yount · Jul 27, 2005

You can only install it at 108 if you degree it; you can only degree it if you have an indexed timing set. If you don't know what a cam card is, get someone that's done a cam install before to help you with this one -- then you'll understand what it's all about.

How do you know you'll have plenty of p to v clearance?

Scorcher2005 · Jul 28, 2005

so where can i get an indexed timing set? I know a few people around here w/ some experience, so maybe they can stop by that day.

And about pv clearance...because many others run the cam w/ stock internals, and TFS says so also

Michael Yount · Jul 28, 2005

Ford Racing sells indexed sets - many others too - Summit, Jeg's, etc.

You should get in the habit of always checking p to v when a cam change (with more duration) occurs. Each engine and combo is different when it comes to those kinds of detailed dimensions - you'll likely be ok, but you're just guessing/hoping unless you measure; and it's a big price to pay (bent pushrods/valves at best) Good luck with it.

Scorcher2005 · Jul 28, 2005

so would this set do fine? Its a Ford racing timing chain set and says:
Maximum Advance/Retard at Crankshaft:8*
and
Maximum Advance/Retard at Camshaft:4*

Its part number FMS-M-6268-B302 on www.summitracing.com

Scorcher2005 · Jul 28, 2005

well, i just called up a friend and he recommended that i just install it dot to dot and then if i need more advance, do it with the distributor instead. And i found the cam specs:
Intake Cam Timing at .050" Valve Lift:
Opens 3 degrees BTDC
Closes 38 degrees ABDC
Max lift: 108 degrees ATDC
Exhaust Cam Timing at .050" Valve Lift:
Opens 49 degrees BBDC
Closes 4 degrees BTDC
Max lift: 116 degrees BTDC

HISSIN50 · Jul 28, 2005

Scorcher2005 said:
well, i just called up a friend and he recommended that i just install it dot to dot and then if i need more advance, do it with the distributor instead. And i found the cam specs:
Intake Cam Timing at .050" Valve Lift:
Opens 3 degrees BTDC
Closes 38 degrees ABDC
Max lift: 108 degrees ATDC
Exhaust Cam Timing at .050" Valve Lift:
Opens 49 degrees BBDC
Closes 4 degrees BTDC
Max lift: 116 degrees BTDC

I might want to ask another friend (nothing against this guy - I am sure he is very knowledgable). Cam timing is separate from ignition timing. Cam timing has to do with the valve events (in relation to the piston location). Ignition timing has to do with when the spark fires (in relation to piston location).

you can not do anything with the spark timing to change the cam to piston timing.

Good luck.

Scorcher2005 · Jul 28, 2005

HISSIN50 said:
I might want to ask another friend (nothing against this guy - I am sure he is very knowledgable). Cam timing is separate from ignition timing. Cam timing has to do with the valve events (in relation to the piston location). Ignition timing has to do with when the spark fires (in relation to piston location).

you can not do anything with the spark timing to change the cam to piston timing.

Good luck.

yeah, i was thinking that as he was telling me. Hes also a GM guy. but he also knew what i meant when i told him 108* centerline. And he said its better just to line it up dot to dot and not have anything go wrong and have pv issues. and if i need advance, do it through the dizzy.

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