extended use motor oil nonsense..

MikeZ28 said:

you can bring your oil too whatever lab you want... i have personally torn eninges down that were not maintained and went long periods of time without oil changes... it's not pretty...

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My brother owns an engine rebuilding company, I give him a hand from time to time and have seen some pretty nasty stuff people bring in. Some days he'll have 20-30 engines ready to go into the acid tanks that have had infrequent oil changes and are so gummed up, it's amazing that they even went are far as they did.
If all you do is drive on the highway, you can extend your oil changes somewhat, but if you make alot of short trips or drive in dusty conditions you should change the oil regularly. It's far cheaper to change your oil than to change your engine.

MikeZ28 said:

yeah maintaining your car is a giant conspiracy too steal your money

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Mike, rjstaaf spelled everything out for you, numerically and scientifically. That site has some great discussions regarding proper intervals.

Maintaining your car is cleaning it, making sure it is running as efficiently as possible, and replenishing/changing your fluids "as or before necessary". You can define "necessary" based on scientific evidence or what your grandfather passed down to your father and passed down to you - it's your choice.

I assume by your reasoning that someone who changes their oil every 500 miles maintains their car six times better than you...?

MikeZ28 said:

yeah maintaining your car is a giant conspiracy too steal your money

soon we will see you post on here... WTF my motor blew and i dont know why

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Another benefit to used oil analysis is that they also measure the wear metals from the motor that are suspended in the oil. I would know far sooner than you would if my motor was having abnormal wear issues. From the oil analysis the wear in my motor is below average. It can also warn you of problems like engine coolant or fuel in your oil.

Don't hold your breath waiting for that post

MikeZ28 said:

i get my info from years of building modern muscle cars.. and from personal experence in a shop...

all of the really high mileage cars i work on ( one of them is a 1994 t-bird SC with 298,000 + miles on the original never touched motor) had oil changes every 3k miles... and all the motors on regular use cars i have had done had a rusted on oil filter and thick as axle greese oil in it... and if you look at the oil change sticker it went 10k plus since the last oil change...

i have one customer with a LT-1 camaro with over 150k miles on the original motor and he sprays on it... why does it still run... a good tune and every 2.5k it gets royal purple witch has been tested too be the best.. (GM high tech ran a article with tests years ago)

you trust your labs... i will trust the motors i have had too rebuild for people that did not change their oil...

plus what does it hurt too have nice fresh clean oil that has not been run thru many heat cycles... what is it you cant do a oil change??

i know you will respond back with the lab stuff again... but fact is every single motor i have replaced did not get regular oil changes...

i dont even know why i am writing this... i hope you get a lot of people too go 10-15k on thier oil... do me a favor convince people that own regular cars (i like mustangs too much too see them abused) and tell people from massachusetts... more money in my pocket when their motor goes...

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Have you even read anything I posted because your posts seem like some sort of knee jerk reaction. Nowhere in any of my posts did I suggest you can take just any oil off the shelf and expect it to go 10-15K. There are oils out there I wouldn't leave in my motor long enough to go around the block. The practice of extended drain intervals involves lots of testing and monitoring. Sounds like what you are talking about is the Soccer mom who gets her oil changed at the quick lube place and doesn't get it changed again for 10K. That is not the practice of extended drain intervals, that is just neglect. There are situations such as someone who does only frequent short trips where used oil analysis might show the oil needs to be changed at 3K.

My whole point and the point of used oil analysis is to not waste the oil by just blindly changing it at 3K but, rather through used oil analysis determining how long the oil will go before it starts to break down.

Eventually your aren't going to have a choice, extended drain intervals are here to stay. More and more cars are being manufactured with oil monitoring systems which will determine when you change the oil and Porsche has even started manufacturing motors without a dipstick. Oil is a resource that we don't have an infinite supply of so why throw it away before necessary?

You can rationalize your 3K oil change interval any way you want, I have given evidence that good oils can last well beyond 3K without causing abnormal engine wear. You chose to ignore it, that is your choice.

Just for giggles here is a used oil analysis from a guy with a 2004 Honda CR-V on a 10,000 mile oil change interval with Mobil 1 0W-20 and he plans to do 15,000 next change. This is on regular Mobil 1, not the Mobil 1 Extended Performance which should perform even better. If you look at the wear numbers, they are right where they should be, no abnormal wear at all. There are plenty more examples just like this one.

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=002323#000020

I'm pretty sure you won't see much engine wear on cars that have had oil/filter changes every 3000 miles, but I also believe you won't see much wear on engines that change it when it needs to be changed (lab tested). My father in law is a mechanic (actually, he works on Caterpillar engines), and he uses Schaeffer (sp?) oil. He sends a sample to a lab, and from the results he determines when the oil needs to be changed. The engines he works on sometimes go over 15000 miles before being changed, and they have saved a fair amount of money. If someone wants to throw their money away on oil changes every 3000 miles, that's their prerogative.

I use Motorcraft 5W-20 and change it every 3000 miles, just like Ford tells me to

starchman said:

I'm pretty sure you won't see much engine wear on cars that have had oil/filter changes every 3000 miles, but I also believe you won't see much wear on engines that change it when it needs to be changed (lab tested). My father in law is a mechanic (actually, he works on Caterpillar engines), and he uses Schaeffer (sp?) oil. He sends a sample to a lab, and from the results he determines when the oil needs to be changed. The engines he works on sometimes go over 15000 miles before being changed, and they have saved a fair amount of money. If someone wants to throw their money away on oil changes every 3000 miles, that's their prerogative.

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It is Schaeffer, http://specializedlubricants.net/

Thanks for the link; I've been meaning to look it up. My wife and I are starting to use it as well.

you are all a bunch of fools.

if you look in the majority of cars owners manuals, the oil changes are scheduled at 7,500miles on DINO oil, 3000miles was something that was invented by the oil companies to sell more oil.

example- my father bought a 95 BMW 530i with the 3.0 litre v8 in it, in manual said to change at 7500, from day 1 he ran mobil 1 full synthetic, and did the oil changes every 22,000 miles, yes thats right 22k between changes. the car lasted 240,000 miles and 9 years before my brother hydrolocked it...it would have lasted a lot longer if that hadnt happened...i followed the same routine in my turbocharged eclipse, using full synthetic every 18k would change it, i abused the car, drove hard and NEVER once did i ever have any kind of mechanical problems with it, never any metal shavings, compression was perfect...and as of now i plan on the same thing with the stang, i will start off slow, using full synthetic, start with a change at 3k, then 6k, then 9k and so on...and will monitor it closely, but i am confident in the results.

starchman said:

Thanks for the link; I've been meaning to look it up. My wife and I are starting to use it as well.

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Not sure if you already know but, they are a sponsor over at www.bobistheoilguy.com and post frequently to the forums there as well.

No, I didn't; I just visited the site, but didn't have much time to really check it out. My supervisor keeps walking by.

Justin03GT said:

you are all a bunch of fools.

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Wow, thanks! I stopped reading your post after that sentence. Way to communicate... FYI, try not starting your post out with an insult if you want people to actually read it...

How many times am I going to see these arguments where the know it alls are telling the meticulous that theyre wasting money and theyre wrong

YOU ARE NOT WRONG FOR CHANGING YOUR SYNTHETIC OIL EVERY 3K MILES. LET IT GO. please, give it a rest. if you can afford an hour and 45 dollars every 3k miles, and if it keeps your mind at ease, do it. I change my mobil 1 oil and filter every 3k miles and im not throwing money away, because ive had major problems with my BMW going over 5k miles with synthetic and the motor went. Im paranoid, and if you have a problem with that, you go ahead and change your oil every 30,000 miles if you like.
So sick of reading these posts where youre WASTING MONEY AND TIME AND YOU NEED TO ANALYZE YOUR OIL IF YOU ARE A TRUE CAR LOVER!



-Jon

1fast03pony said:

How many times am I going to see these arguments where the know it alls are telling the meticulous that theyre wasting money and theyre wrong

YOU ARE NOT WRONG FOR CHANGING YOUR SYNTHETIC OIL EVERY 3K MILES. LET IT GO. please, give it a rest. if you can afford an hour and 45 dollars every 3k miles, and if it keeps your mind at ease, do it. I change my mobil 1 oil and filter every 3k miles and im not throwing money away, because ive had major problems with my BMW going over 5k miles with synthetic and the motor went. Im paranoid, and if you have a problem with that, you go ahead and change your oil every 30,000 miles if you like.
So sick of reading these posts where youre WASTING MONEY AND TIME AND YOU NEED TO ANALYZE YOUR OIL IF YOU ARE A TRUE CAR LOVER!



-Jon

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By the same token the practice of extended drain intervals is not nonsense as the title of this thread would suggest.

Aside from my point that you are throwing money away by changing oil at 3K without an analysis to determine if it could go longer, there is also the issue of the current high prices for oil and that it is not an infinite resource. Obviously this is a concern as even the auto manufacturers are looking at ways to extend oil changes. Several foreign auto manufacturers have had oil life monitors in their cars for a while now and recently some US automakers have started installing them as well. This is a trend that will continue. Amsoil has advocated extended drain intervals since the '70s and Mobil did back then as well and is only now starting to advocate it again. It will not be long before we see other oil companies follow suit.

Not sure if any of you have heard but, the government is looking into extending daylight savings time by two months in the hope that it will save 10,000 barrels of oil a day.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/04/07/daylight.saving.ap/index.html

We use 20 million barrels of oil a day here in the US. If you aren't worried about the cost, maybe you should think about conserving a limited resource for future generations. I am sure I will probably be called an radical environmentalist and be flamed for that as well

rjstaaf said:

By the same token the practice of extended drain intervals is not nonsense as the title of this thread would suggest.

Aside from my point that you are throwing money away by changing oil at 3K without an analysis to determine if it could go longer, there is also the issue of the current high prices for oil and that it is not an infinite resource. Obviously this is a concern as even the auto manufacturers are looking at ways to extend oil changes. Several foreign auto manufacturers have had oil life monitors in their cars for a while now and recently some US automakers have started installing them as well. This is a trend that will continue. Amsoil has advocated extended drain intervals since the '70s and Mobil did back then as well and is only now starting to advocate it again. It will not be long before we see other oil companies follow suit.

Not sure if any of you have heard but, the government is looking into extending daylight savings time by two months in the hope that it will save 10,000 barrells of oil a day.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/04/07/daylight.saving.ap/index.html

If you aren't worried about the cost, maybe you should think about conserving a limited resource for future generations. I am sure I will probably be called an radical environmentalist and be flamed for that as well

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No, i completely respect conservation of the environment, and i completely respect your position of extended oil use. But, my point is that I really dont think that arguing back and forth about who's wrong or whos wasting money or whos destroying their engines is old, and its gone on for 3 or 4 threads before.
Whichever you feell better doing, its your money and your environment. I choose to change my oil every 3k miles to have peace of mind, which i rarely have with cars.

I change mine at 3-5k with durablend... when the warranty is up I'll switch to full synthetic and change it at 5k. And while the analysis thing seems cool, I cant understand the gibberish on it. Being the stock motor, and the fact that one day I will S/C a built block I really dont care what happens to the stocker after the warranty is up and the car is paid off.
HOWEVER I do mind reading these BS posts. I understand where both sides are coming from, but unfrotunately, until Ford supports the 5k or 7.5k or even 10+k oil change, while its under warranty its getting changed at 3k or I'm aquiring reciepts to say it was. The way both sides are posting I have to go with the "play it safe, 3k" people. Honestly that is the only option to take, warranty or not, nothing on the internet is "fact", because as this thread proves, for every "fact" there is an "anti-fact". I honestly believe that oil will last 5-10k between changes, but until the majority (51%) of auto makers and/or media proves it, I'm playing it safe and adding to hiked gas prices and holy wars.... happily I might add.

1fast03pony said:

No, i completely respect conservation of the environment, and i completely respect your position of extended oil use. But, my point is that I really dont think that arguing back and forth about who's wrong or whos wasting money or whos destroying their engines is old, and its gone on for 3 or 4 threads before.
Whichever you feell better doing, its your money and your environment. I choose to change my oil every 3k miles to have peace of mind, which i rarely have with cars.

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Actually variations of this thread happen more like 3-4 times a month. I made a major effort to provide facts and resources for people who read this thread to to make up their own minds. As I have suggested several times, anyone can do a used oil analysis without giving up their 3K oil change interval. Just take a sample at 3K while you do your oil change and then send the sample in. At the very least you can see what shape your oil and motor is in. Optimally you will see that at 3K most oils still have a lot of life left.