I just read on another forum about a set of road racing cams for the 4.6 3 valve. There due to be released soon, they make 30 hp and 20 foot pounds on a stock motor. They make 75 hp and 46 foot pounds with ported heads. They had a sound clip from youtube, they sounded good. Has anyone else heard of these new ford cams? The numbers look pretty impressive for a set of cams.
Ford racing cams?
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walter
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blacksheep06
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If they have a lopey sound then it's probably not stock springs. The problem I have with doing cams is you don't know whether your going to get 30hp or 10hp.
Thats why I posted this, all I've read since I've been here is that cams don't do much for our cars other than a cool lope. Cams that would make some serious power and torque without robbing the mid range is worth investigating. I can't remember if they mentioned springs or not, but I'm sure they would be needed with those kind of gains. 75 hp on ported heads would get us all so close to that elusive 400 hp all motor, of course that would be at the crank, but still. If we start out with 300 hp, pick up 75 with ported heads and cams, seems like you could get another 25 or so with headers, udp's, tune and intake. If someone would develope us a nice intake manifold to throw into the mix, we would be setting pretty. I still believe a 400 hp n/a 4.6 will be common place before long. Time will tell if I'm right I guess.
Any cam that gains a lot of high end power is likely going to loose low end torque. To gain power above 5k you need to increase airflow, you do this by holding the valves further open for longer (more lift and duration), but this kills air/fuel and exhaust velocity in the lower RPM range which hurts torque.
A lopey idle doesn't mean the cam requires better springs. Springs are needed with higher lift cams, the lope is more a product of the cam duration and lobe separation.
Dan
A lopey idle doesn't mean the cam requires better springs. Springs are needed with higher lift cams, the lope is more a product of the cam duration and lobe separation.
Dan
I have spoken to some very well-known and respected people from 3 shops that everyone here knows of and they all insisted that the cams in the video with the "pink" car would require springs because of higher lift.
I finally got someone at FRPP to talk to me about the cams (they told me countless times that they don't exist, no info, can't say...yada yada yada) and he said they do not require springs and that the idle comes from the duration not higher lift. He also said there isn't any loss of power low to mid and decent gains up top but no concrete numbers yet.
I don't agree that you have to lose low end torque to make more power though because these cars have variable cam timing. The duration changes with the rpm.
I finally got someone at FRPP to talk to me about the cams (they told me countless times that they don't exist, no info, can't say...yada yada yada) and he said they do not require springs and that the idle comes from the duration not higher lift. He also said there isn't any loss of power low to mid and decent gains up top but no concrete numbers yet.
I don't agree that you have to lose low end torque to make more power though because these cars have variable cam timing. The duration changes with the rpm.
blacksheep06
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Well if they'll make 30 hp, utilize stock springs, AND have a lope then I'll be a monkey's bare ass uncle.
Seriously that would be awesome
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1mYzsxMbo4&feature=related
These must be the ones were talking about?
Seriously that would be awesome
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1mYzsxMbo4&feature=related
These must be the ones were talking about?
I still have signifigant doubts that these will not need new springs, with that type of idle and power. But I'm dying to be proved wrong! I'll buy 2 sets. But until I hear a couple of real people's experiences with these things, I won't hold my breath about not needing new springs.
blacksheep06
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http://www.suttonhp.com/store/item.asp?ITEM_ID=765&DEPARTMENT_ID=253
Sutton has them and says there's no need to replace springs.
Sutton has them and says there's no need to replace springs.
chad9350
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hearing different stories...
Other than whatever they have at FRPP, there are only 2 sets of these cams. Justin Burcham has a set which is the one on youtube. The other set is in transit to another shop and I promised not to mention any names.
Anyone else that claims to have them, know when they are being released, or have them on order is either mistaken or a liar. Doug at Sutton is taking pre-orders which means he is making a list of people who are interested, he is not even taking any money yet.
I have no factual basis for this whatsoever but I am guessing from what I have heard that they will be out within the next few weeks. I do know that if I don't end up being the guinea pig with that other test set then I will do whatever I can to get a set when they come out. I know that there is a lot of doubt but I have been assured that they will not require springs, will make 20+ peak RWHP, and will not lose any low end power.
Not looking to argue with anyone, just hoping the rumors are true!
blacksheep06
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Mike I don't know all that much about lift and duration, but with an agressive lope like these have, do you think the stock valve springs will hold up for the long run?
I honestly don't know much about this stuff either. Every time I talked to someone about getting a cam with a rough idle they all have told me that it requires increasing the lift which would require springs. The Ford engineer said that would be true if they increased the lift but they did it by increasing the duration. He told me that with these cams the stock springs are good up to 6400 rpm. That is fine with me since the power drops off on these motors before that anyway.
blacksheep06
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1) Increased Lift of 1mm with the Hot Rod cams( 12mm ), stock( 11mm )
2) These cams move the engine RPM power band to about 6700 RPM.
The stock springs can handle these to those limits. If you intend to push them beyond that RPM wise, you need new and better springs.
blacksheep06
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