Hell yeah.turboscrew said:Hell guys, think about it. LS1's should be a little faster ,I mean they have 1.1 liters more than us and about 40-50 more horsepower. What do you expect out of a 281 vs 350. Besides they're still ****ty. Stangs rule
LeadSled1 said:Actually if you really look at the graphs they are quite different. The torque/hp on the LS1 graph are skewed and yours are not. Here are the differences:
LS1 GT Dif
2500 150 120 30
3000 180 150 30
3500 210 190 20
4000 255 230 25
4500 285 270 15
5000 310 290 20
5500 305 305 0
5800 305 305 0
Due to the scewing of the first graph it looks funky. Look at how the torque drops off ll the way to the bottom of the graph but it is making 275 rwtq at that point. Look at the difference in the increments between the torque and hp on the graph.
MustangLife said:Heads and Cam LS1 cars are running 7.5 to 7.0's in the 1/8 mile or mid 11's high 10's in the 1/4 mile. At least the guys around here that go to the track that i know. Some of them are spraying to and getting mid 6's in the 1/8 mile which is good for well into the 10's.
A centrifugal 4.6 with 500-600 rwhp is about equal to a 400-430 rwhp motor ls1 car.
Good luck
Josh
500-600 RWHP 2V MUSTANG = 10'SMustangLife said:Heads and Cam LS1 cars are running 7.5 to 7.0's in the 1/8 mile or mid 11's high 10's in the 1/4 mile. At least the guys around here that go to the track that i know. Some of them are spraying to and getting mid 6's in the 1/8 mile which is good for well into the 10's.
A centrifugal 4.6 with 500-600 rwhp is about equal to a 400-430 rwhp motor ls1 car.
Good luck
Josh
MustangLife said:My car with 256 rwhp and 302 rwtq with 4.10's, nitto dr's, upper and lower control arms, rear seat delete, lakewood 90/10 struts, fox body 4cyl front springs on the street from a low kick vs. a bone stock 00 trans am. Was a good race. I pulled ahead the 1st 2 gears by 2 cars. Once I went into 3rd gear the ls1 pulled ahead by about car and up to 120 mph was the same with the ls1 ahead a car. We did this about 5 times all the same. And from a high kick like 25 or so which is with me in 2nd gear and him in 1st. Was dead even until i went into 3rd and pulled away a car or 2.
A bone stock ls1 car with a good driver can run high 12's to low 13's straight out fo the box vs. us straight out of the box is about a second slower. Remember these ls1 cars have a ****ty geared t-56. So 1st gear for them is like us having a 2.73 gear in our cars.
Josh
MediocrGenerica said:As an outsider, and newbie to this forum, it is clear to me what is going on here. There are the Mustang guys who give credit where credit is due, and there are those who don't.
When comparing the Mustang and the F-body, there are a number of factors that must be taken into consideration that are not being taken by many of those who are posting in this thread.
1) It is a fact that the LS1 is a motor that was designed to make power, and lots of it. It is rather severly underrated from the factory, has an awesome powerband, and responds extremely well to simple bolt-on modifications. With the exception of being ridiculously difficult to work on at times, it is a v8 tuner's dream. The modular 4.6 was too, designed to make power, but it was also designed to be a multi-duty engine meant to see service in police cruisers along with your beloved 'stangs. Take solace in the fact that your 4.6's will 9 times out of 10 last twice as long as the LS1's will.
2) As much as price is a silly thing to consider when having a technical discussion, it must be considered in this case. Flat out, the F-body was/is more powerful, more expensive to produce vehicle. Its price reflected this. The Mustang, with clever packaging of the powertrain and an old design, was/is not nearly as costly to manufacture, and thats why some people got brand new GT's under 20k.
The 4.6L 2v, from a performance and tuning standpoint, is an inferior powerplant. The LS1 will make more power, period. It will, however, cost more in the first place and probably cost more in the long run to upgrade and maintain. Therefore, from the standpoint of practicality, the 4.6L is the superior motor.
This is just my opinion, but I feel that some people are getting too emotional/"into it," and aren't making sense.
No, 4.56s. 2400 rpm @ 70 mph. 28 mpg on the highway.JBVobra said:great times, but 4.88 gears??
Was 2.95 (similar to your Z06), now 2.92.whats the first gear in that T5?
None (that was a T45 problem). FYI, I now have G-Force components in my T5, which includes a 26 spline, GM-Style input shaft.how many input/output shafts have you sheared off of the tranny?
We all have our opinion of what "ridiculous" is and what a "drag suspension" is, but I'll list my stuff and let you and everybody else decide for themselves.there's a definitive line between having a nice street car that performs well and behaves well as compared to transforming a nice street car into an all out 1/4 mile car with ridiculous gearing and drag suspension.
1) We've already covered the gearingSure, your motor is "stock", but what kind of person wants to cruise around town with 4.88 gears?
Thank you, as are yours.Not knocking the times cosby, they're impressive.
Again, we all have our opinions, but what makes it a "1/4 slave"? It has a very compliant suspension, A/C, nice seats, a nice stereo, stock idle and driving manners, gets good mileage, etc, etc.That nice little 99 cobra has just turned into a 1/4 slave for most peoples taste.
No doubt abou that. My only point of disagreement here is your "sanely geared" implication. An LS1 simply doesn't have the rpm potential to take advantage of more gear, or they'd use it. Of course, it doesn't need it either. In the end, the result is very near the same.You could get very near performance out of a sanely geared F-Bod with a nice cam package. For pretty cheap, too.
LOL. Let me assure you that I could comfortably start YOUR car in 2nd gear. Or a stock 03 Cobra. Or a stock 03 Mach. It's not a big deal. At all.JBVobra said:-if you can start the car from a dead stop comfortably in second gear, that seems to meet the criteria of "ridiculous" in my book.
I can't help but laugh at this - no, it doesn't, though I wouldn't really care if it did (I don't street race). Depending upon the road, and how I hit it, I can certainly light the tires in 1st from a slow roll, and sometimes in second. But DOHC motors simply don't make big power down low. You know that. Except from a dead stop, it is not hard at all to control/prevent wheelspin.That pretty much seals the deal on ever going WOT in the first two gears on the street, even with DR's.
Correct - it wasn't bad. I've done it. Have you?And it "wasn't bad" with 4.88s??
Yup, I had a bone stock 98 too, and never got better than 25-26 mpg highway. But with my 99, damn near everything I've done to improve power in the motor has also improved efficiency and thus gas mileage. Weight, exhaust, pullies, etc - even the internal engine mods - the only way to get more power with stock cams and unported heads is to make the engine more efficient. Think about it.you're mileage at seventy is at least 3 mpg better than I ever had with my 98 when it was bonestock with a 3.27 rear.
LOL. Ya. I went both ways (there and back). Besides, there ain't much elevation change between Washington DC and Virginia Beach. Check your handy-dandy road atlas.Are you sure this wasn't a trip with a significant drop in elevation (serious question)?
Yup - I have a .59 5th gear (stock is .68). There's more to it, too. I have 26.7" tall rear street tires. That's how I get 2400 rpm @ 70 mph. Of note, I still got ~25 with the T45 and 4.56s running near 2800 rpm @ 70 mph.Or is that T5 5th a steeper gear than the T45 5th?
Ok. But if what I have is what you consider a "drag suspension", then I suggest going out and getting in a real drag car, then one like mine, and comparing them. In short - there is no comparison.-we'll agree to disagree on the question of suspension change.
Nope, don't think I said or implied any such thing. I am saying that I have more rpm potential than most LS1s (certainly those with stock cams), and can take advantage of the extra torque multiplication of steeper gears.-an LS1 certainly needs some gearing help. The fbod T56 has a horrendous 2.66 1st gear, so it does need some multiplication to yank a 60ft. Are you trying to say a 3.42 fbod would not run a faster 1/4 with 3.90s?
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