Pinging and light smoke at top-end RPM's

[Darkwriter77]

I've always had this problem, but I thought for awhile that perhaps I'd advanced my timing too far and the car just didn't like going with 14*. However, bumping it back to 12* and even the stock 10* results in the same thing (but with an obvious loss in power, of course).

Basically, when I'm romping it at WOT, I will get a light amount of what sounds like mild pinging and just a little bit of blue smoke (just enough to notice in the rearview mirror) when I'm pushing it above 3500 RPM at WOT. There's no skipping, hesitation, or anything, and there's not any noticable loss in power, but I kinda wonder if the issue is either that I'm running too lean somehow (thus, the ping) and I'm just getting a little bit of unrelated blowby on the piston rings (I'm estimating it's got about 100k since it was rebuilt), or if maybe it's more a matter of the valvetrain getting sloppy on the top-end somehow - valve springs getting soft and not closing fast enough, valve seals leaking a bit of oil, timing chain stretching at high-RPM and causing weirdness, etc. The smoke only occurs at the same time as the pinging, and the pinging happens sort of intermittently - not in any certain gear or speed, just every once in awhile above 3500 RPM.

Compared to my '90 TownCar, my notch chugs oil like a mofo, but I'm not leaking out anywhere and the inside of my tailpipes and my plugs aren't getting fouled with it. I use a quart every week and a half to two weeks, which is about every 750 miles for me - not a huge amount, really, but it's more than double than the Lincoln with 200k on the original mill that only uses a single quart between oil changes. Oil consumption seems to go up a lot more if I get happy with the leadfoot, which is when I'm experiencing the above light smoke and pinging, which is why I suspected blowby and/or leaky valves/seals, but not the pinging.

I wish I'd had someone taking some video from the outside on my last track run, so I could have seen whether I was experiencing the same top-end smoking issue back then, but I didn't have any ping going on at the time.

FWIW, I've been running QuikTrip 91 octane religiously since I've bumped the timing. Is it possible that I need to start dumping some hardcore octane booster in there to get it up more towards 93 octane to prevent the pinging? (I can't find a single station around here that pumps 92 or 93 octane.)

So ... any ideas? Low octane, worn valvetrain/timing chain, blowby, or something else?

 

[Roland69]

what octane do you use....Mine shows some BLACK smoke at WOT at upper RPM's but that is how most SD ones are. They have a rich fuel curve. I would check and see if yours is black and not blue smoke and try a better fuel. Being you are MASS I am unsure if you would be rich at WOT like mine

 

[Darkwriter77]

I have always run 91 octane from QuikTrip (though I doubt the brand makes a difference in this case). Again, if I could find a place that pumps 92 or 93, I'd give that a try.

I never really get much chance to really check the smoke color, but from what I've seen in the rearview mirror, it looks blue to me. Guess I could have someone follow me sometime when I get on it from a stop and see if they can get a better look. I have read somewhere that Mass Air cars actually tend to run richer than SD motors, but I dunno, maybe something's throwing the mix off and making it lean at the top-end of WOT, hence the pinging...? Everything from idle to 3500 is beautiful, and usually the top-end isn't much of a problem, but when I do get it, the ping is notable, as is the smoke.

Hearing mention in the EGR spacer bypass thread that bypassing the coolant lines to the EGR spacer supposedly can cause pinging has me wondering - now that I think about it, it does seem to be more prevalent when it's hot outside, and theoretically when the motor's running hotter. I really have no way of reconnecting them, short of buying a whole new heater pipe and all that, but perhaps investing in a phenolic spacer would help keep the upper intake manifold cool enough to compensate for the lack of coolant lines going to the spacer?

 

[dacolino]

What kind of Oil do you run? For the hell of it, I would try running 4 quarts of 10-40 and a quart of lucas oil stabilizer...Cant hurt for sure, that lucas stuff is really great. I put it in my 85 (had some oil smoke and began to eat oil like crazy) I put that stuff in and the smoking was gone for a while but it is smoking a tiny bit now...but it has only ate a 1/2 quart in 2k miles. Also I would recommend running higher grade fuel if possible because you have the timing advanced still right? If that stuff dosent work then check fuel pressure to get an idea of what the car is running at.

 

[bluevenom867]

If oil goes into the combustion chamber,its going to reduce the octane and detonation supression abilities of the fuel.Try some 100 octane (just like 4 gallons) and run the timing at 14* if it doesnt ping but still shows a little smoke,then its probably burning some oil.

 

[uedlose]

I am thinking the same think as bluevenom.

 

[Darkwriter77]

Okay, sorry to sound snotty here, but ... AGAIN, I can NOT find any station around here that pumps anything above 91 octane! Believe me, if it was out there, I'd be dumping it in there and giving it a try. I'd had it advanced to 14* for a long time, and I never took much notice of the problem before because of all the other tuning issues I'd had from crappy old sensors and bad grounds n' such before. Now that all that noise is ironed out and I still have this pinging/smoke thing, I've tried retarding the timing to stock 10* for awhile, but it didn't help the pinging at WOT and the car feels like a dog by comparison. I've since put it back up to 12* - feels better, but same problems.

The only alternative I can see to driving all over the state in search of a high-octane fuel station is to dump in some of that darned NOS brand supa-dupa octane booster (the only one that appears that it would get me at or above 93 octane ... at $10 a pop ) and hope that it cures the pinging.

As far as the oil consumption, I'm probably going to switch to 20w-50 with my next oil change here in the next week or so. The only things I've had any success with that Lucas makes are their fuel injector cleaner (pretty average stuff, but it's cheap) and their power steering stop-leak (thick as snot, slowed the Lincoln's PS leak from a full slobber down to a slow drool) - I'd sooner dump in a bottle of plain ol' STP, as it's almost identical goop and costs 1/3 the price of Lucas. I was afraid that I'd been running too thick of a weight before when I'd been running 20w-50 last year, but since I downgraded to 10w-40, my oil consumption seems to have increased at about the same time (though I still think the high-RPM WOT smoke/pinging issue is related). Heck, maybe even 15w-50 Mobil 1 would be a better compromise - I can go TWO months instead of ONE between oil changes, given the number of miles I crank out every 30 days.

So, am I way off base thinking that my EGR spacer coolant line bypass might be in any way related to the pinging? ... being that higher intake manifold temps supposedly cause detonation issues?

 

[Roland69]

maby your hearing some loose rockers or something in the top end

 

[Darkwriter77]

Gawd, I hope not! I don't have the time or funding to mess with rebuilding the top-end of the motor.

 

[bluevenom867]

You can order a 5 gallon can of unlead race fuel from most manufacters.

 

[1990stanglx]

HEY EVERYONE THE PROBLEM THE GUY WITH THE PINGING AND SMOKE AT HIGH RPMS I HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM I TRIED THE 117 OCTAINE FUEL HELP A LITTLE I FOUND IT TO BE A STRECHED CHAIN MY ENGINE SO THE BEST THING WAS TO REBUILD IT NO LONGER HAVE THAT PROBLEM

 

[1990stanglx]

HEY EVERYONE THE PROBLEM THE GUY WITH THE PINGING AND SMOKE AT HIGH RPMS I HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM I TRIED THE 117 OCTAINE FUEL HELP A LITTLE I FOUND IT TO BE A STRECHED CHAIN MY ENGINE SO THE BEST THING WAS TO REBUILD IT NO LONGER HAVE THAT PROBLEM

 

[Darkwriter77]

Again, I hope it's nothing that severe. The last thing I need to be screwing with right now is tearing off everything from the frontside of the motor and ripping off that stupid timing cover to replace the gears/chain (because I just know the darned cover will break or I'll wind up with broken/stripped bolts in the process, knowing my luck). The theory does sound plausible, though.

Hopefully, if it's something that major, it's something that I can put off long enough until I can afford to score a beater car of some kind (I'm thinkin' a 4-banger 'Stanger) that I can drive while I'm ripping the guts out of this one. As it sits now, it's my only DD, and if it's out of commission, I'm pretty much SOL.

Okay, so easy solutions or band-aids I could use so far include:
- Use thicker oil (20w-50) and/or oil treatment
- Dump high-grade octane booster in there on a regular basis
- Get a phenolic spacer to hopefully compensate for the lack of coolant lines going to the EGR spacer
- Pray to voodoo Ford gods that it isn't something requiring a rebuild of the valvetrain and/or bottom end

Otherwise, it's either a new timing set, valve work, and/or a bottom-end rebuild. And if it ever comes to a full rebuild again, I'd might as well look into getting it bored out to a 306 - or, funds permitting, maybe even a stroker kit - as this'll at least be this motor's second rebuild. Sure wish I had a storage shed and an engine stand; I'd have a shortblock all cleaned up and I could be building it up piece by piece while I wait for this one to take a dump on me.

At least the oil consumption and pinging haven't become a serious, SERIOUS issue ... yet...