Roush Potential HP question

SatinSilverStan · Mar 21, 2006

Hello everyone...I have some mods in mind but before sending the money I would like to see what everyones opinions are in regards to the amount of HP that should come from doing the

I own an 02 S281SC Vert

following mods:

Ceramic Long Tubes(Already have, just not installed)
Rip Kit
75 MM throttle body
Stage 1 or 2 cams(I want to retain a decent idle)
off road X
66mm Blower Pulley
And a Dyno Tune for 93 octane
Bigger Heat Exchanger & Coolant Resevoir

One thing I don't understand is how so many people seem to be stuck at around 350RWHP with the series 2 blowers. What do you all feel that I could RWHP wise out of the above Mods?

SatinSilverStan · Mar 21, 2006

the way I am looking at this is that I am tremendously increasing the amount of air/gas that is being rammed into the motor, The intake charge should stay cool, and I am maximizing the motors ability to expel the exhaust gases so I should make some serious power should I not? I just don't want to spend about 2 grand doing this and then be disappointed because my HP expectations were unrealistic....

saleen556 · Mar 21, 2006

The series II makes too much heat when installing the smaller pulley.I went the same route and decided to bite the bullet and get a KB.If you are wanting more than 350-360 rwhp then the series II isn't going to do it.

SatinSilverStan · Mar 21, 2006

even with all the supporting mods such as the long tubes, cams, heat exchanger and bigger SC coolant tank? I figured with the support of the longtubes and cams and the addition of the cooling items that the smaller blower pulley would do the get me some where around 380- 390 RWHP...

RedS281GT · Mar 21, 2006

You can make 400rwhp with a series II. The problem is that people don't address the factors that cause the engine to blow up at that hp level! saleen556 is right about the pulley. When you add the pulley, keeping the car cool is the key. I dropped a chicane intercooler in mine and could tell a huge difference. Other mods to keep it cool would be a snow kit, wetter water, & a bigger heat exchanger. I also have the BBK long tubes and they were the best mod that I could have done. I could see u hitting 380-390 easily because of the cams and dyno tune, which most people don't have. It would be alot safer if you had the chicane int. And at that hp level you'll need a larger maf and injectors. I'll be going to the dyno in a few weeks, so I will post my results. Shooting for 425rwhp when it's finished!

00 GT vert S/C
series II, chicane intercooler
BBK longtubes and o/r x
75mm tb, 3:55's

00s281sc368 · Mar 22, 2006

400rwhp ?? No way! Even 380 don't dream about it.
Sorry but I've never seen a series II that makes more than 320~340rwhp. It's just too restrictive to make decent power.

RedS281GT · Mar 22, 2006

You make good points. No one's doing it and it's not efficient power unless you have the cooling mods. But, i've seen a few! Sstrayer made 346rwhp with his series II. The only things he didn't have done to his car were long tubes, intercooler, and a 66mm pulley. That might have gotten him close to the 380 mark. And if u add cams on top of that, it's possible!

SatinSilverStan · Mar 22, 2006

00s281sc368 said:
400rwhp ?? No way! Even 380 don't dream about it.
Sorry but I've never seen a series II that makes more than 320~340rwhp. It's just too restrictive to make decent power.

You say that but...if you look at all the people that have tried and posted the results with there mods, none of them have everything that I have listed... I am confident that 380 - 400 RWHP is possible and reasonably safe with the mods that I have listed. Now I just have to get up the money to buy all the goodies and make it happen!

saleen556 · Mar 22, 2006

SatinSilverStan said:
You say that but...if you look at all the people that have tried and posted the results with there mods, none of them have everything that I have listed... I am confident that 380 - 400 RWHP is possible and reasonably safe with the mods that I have listed. Now I just have to get up the money to buy all the goodies and make it happen!

If your going to spend the $ you would be better off getting the KB or a series 4 blower.Then you won't be limited by the series II.Then if you decide you want more power you will only need a pulley swap.Both blowers can be found used for around 3-4k.

C.Saleen · Mar 22, 2006

series 2

the most ive seen from a series 2 is 340 and that was with cams, its just too small and cant make big #s, people on here have tried, with porting and a series 4 inlet and the mods u mentioned u might make 340 mabey, at the price uve spent, u could have boughten a kenne bell and had unlimited possibilites

psdont forget a pump

SatinSilverStan · Mar 22, 2006

saleen556 said:
If your going to spend the $ you would be better off getting the KB or a series 4 blower.Then you won't be limited by the series II.Then if you decide you want more power you will only need a pulley swap.Both blowers can be found used for around 3-4k.

Well I really do not want anything more then say 400 at the wheels as I don't want to have to forge everything right now, not to mention that I want the car to stay nicely streetable plus I was trying to reach my goal by keeping the car as original as possible since it is a numbered car... What are your guy's thoughts is keeping the car original; meaning original equipment for my year of Saleen an important ideal or will it not matter when/if I ever wanted to sell?

129saleen · Mar 22, 2006

I had the exact same mods as you are planning except the cams and i made 354rwhp and 384rwtq so you can atleast hope to get over my #'s...
They are right about just spending 2k more and getting a KB..You can just buy the lowest intercooled kit and just work from there its alot easier that way...

SatinSilverStan · Mar 22, 2006

129saleen said:
I had the exact same mods as you are planning except the cams and i made 354rwhp and 384rwtq so you can atleast hope to get over my #'s...
They are right about just spending 2k more and getting a KB..You can just buy the lowest intercooled kit and just work from there its alot easier that way...

Well when I spoke to the owner of my local speed shop, He basically stated that the only way to pull out the numbers that I wanted would be to do the whole deal otherwise I would have a bottleneck at one point or another. He recognized that my blower is not that efficient which is why he stated that I did not have the luxury of just upping the boost like most everyone else ad that I would need to address the whole input output efficiency of the motor to see any real improvment in performance.

SatinSilverStan · Mar 22, 2006

What size is the series 2 SC? By this I mean 1.0 ...1.3 liter?

saleen556 · Mar 22, 2006

SatinSilverStan said:
What size is the series 2 SC? By this I mean 1.0 ...1.3 liter?

I believe it's about 1.5L.As far as keeping the saleen mostly stock that's up to you.They made way too many even though they are numbered.Unless you park it and not drive it at all it's not worth it.Have fun with it and mod the hell out of it.You will have a bad ass looking car that can hold it's own on the street.

00s281sc368 · Mar 23, 2006

Just ask google
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=90+cubic+inches+in+liter&btnG=Google+Search

Series I or II M90 is 1.47 liter. But that is not the issue...
The issue is the saleen restrictive intercooler inlet. Increasing boost just gets more heats...

marcus95 · Mar 23, 2006

What you are essentially wanting to do is surround your seriesII ( dog sh** ) with a bunch of diamonds. What everyone is telling you that if you want 375 safe rwhp you could possibly get it there but at what price?
My advice to you is pull your series II and box it up. Spend the additional dough on a 1.7 KB, the kit comes with everything you need to get you at least 380 rwhp or more. You can always build on top of it. Hell, the kit even comes with a decent tune.
I will put money on it right now that if you spend that money with your "speed shop" even with a "safe" tune you won't be satisfied and by pushing any combination of what you are planning will result in piston and or ring failure. You will spend the money on a new short block anyway. Guaranteed. I have personally been involved with the porting of your blower and I'll tell you it's just not worth the time or money for the expected gains you want.
That blower/intercooler design is 10 years old.

s351rspeedster · Mar 23, 2006

marcus95 said:
What you are essentially wanting to do is surround your seriesII ( dog sh** ) with a bunch of diamonds. What everyone is telling you that if you want 375 safe rwhp you could possibly get it there but at what price?
My advice to you is pull your series II and box it up. Spend the additional dough on a 1.7 KB, the kit comes with everything you need to get you at least 380 rwhp or more. You can always build on top of it. Hell, the kit even comes with a decent tune.
I will put money on it right now that if you spend that money with your "speed shop" even with a "safe" tune you won't be satisfied and by pushing any combination of what you are planning will result in piston and or ring failure. You will spend the money on a new short block anyway. Guaranteed. I have personally been involved with the porting of your blower and I'll tell you it's just not worth the time or money for the expected gains you want.
That blower/intercooler design is 10 years old.

......spend the money wisely and go buy yourself a good ole' blown pushrod and you'll never have to worry about hp and tq again Of course, a few of us are bias in this matter....I tried not to make this suggestion as it is off the topic, but I couldn't help myself any longer

.....ok real answer, go spend the money on a KB or even a series IV Saleen blower. Both will get you to the numbers you are looking for and you will be much happier in the end. If you take a poll, 99 out of 100 people will tell you to dump the Series II and upgrade to a different blower....no questions asked!!

Mstng2 · Mar 23, 2006

It's $$ vs HP really if the funds are low, do nothing leave it as is. Funds are medium Do the pulley, a good tune, 3:73 gears, a fuel pump, maybe a snow kit. You'll have a georgeous car that will smoke 90% of everything on the street. You can even hang with the Corvettes. (cept Z06) If you got the $$$$ and really want an 99% unbeatable car you need the whole ball of wax, KB, Duel Cobra Fuel Pumps, bigger MAF, Bigger injectors, Forged SB, Good tune, Long tubes. Or you could go the twin turbo route. My suggestion is do #2 Thats what I did and I am happy with it.

Roush Potential HP question

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