Progress Thread Slow Boat To China

CarMichael Angelo · Apr 18, 2013

I think two small impellers are more likely to get moving more quickly than a single big lazy one. It's been awhile since I even looked at turbos used in competition,...so I'm far from an authority on what makes more sense when end result power is the goal,.....

But.....

While it is more work, and more spensive than a single,...nothing says "Whoa" quite like looking down at two of those dudes hogging up it's own header collector.

But again.......

You do have that "wrong engine in the wrong body" thing detracting from the "whoa appeal" bringing your open hood reaction factor down to a "Ohh,..........that's nice.

In hindsight,....Maybe you should stick w/ a single then.

And why didn't you buy the MS II that I just sold?

hoopty5.0 · Apr 18, 2013

madmike1157 said:
I think two small impellers are more likely to get moving more quickly than a single big lazy one. It's been awhile since I even looked at turbos used in competition,...so I'm far from an authority on what makes more sense when end result power is the goal,.....

But.....

While it is more work, and more spensive than a single,...nothing says "Whoa" quite like looking down at two of those dudes hogging up it's own header collector.

But again.......

You do have that "wrong engine in the wrong body" thing detracting from the "whoa appeal" bringing your open hood reaction factor down to a "Ohh,..........that's nice.

In hindsight,....Maybe you should stick w/ a single then.

And why didn't you buy the MS II that I just sold?

I'd think as soon as people see twins, the package they're wrapped in becomes invisible, no? And I had no idea your MSII was for sale otherwise it would be my MSII.

RacEoHolic330 · Apr 18, 2013

Mike, you'd be surprised how quick the new ceramic ball bearing, billet wheel turbos spool up. Those billet wheels are nearly weightless. Damn impressive.

84Ttop · Apr 18, 2013

A properly sized turbo be it a single or twins will not be lazy or have trouble spooling. The turbo technology has come leaps and bounds in the last few years. Personally for me it would be a single and it would be Intercooled. I can point you in the direction of a nice air to air that fits a fox perfectly. Meth is a bandaid at best if you ask me. The second that meth runs out or stops working your poor destroyed motor will wish you sprung for an Intercooler.

hoopty5.0 · Apr 18, 2013

84Ttop said:
A properly sized turbo be it a single or twins will not be lazy or have trouble spooling. The turbo technology has come leaps and bounds in the last few years. Personally for me it would be a single and it would be Intercooled. I can point you in the direction of a nice air to air that fits a fox perfectly. Meth is a bandaid at best if you ask me. The second that meth runs out or stops working your poor destroyed motor will wish you sprung for an Intercooler.

Thanks, thats why I was looking for input. I have nothing against running an intercooler, I was just trying to save money and see how far below $10k I can keep the budget. With the tubular front end, I'll have enough room to run a monster intercooler should I choose to do so. And assuming I do (and probably will) hurt the motor, I'll hop on CL and buy a short block for a couple bills and bever miss a beat. Junkyard motors are a beautiful thing.

hoopty5.0 · Apr 18, 2013

RacEoHolic330 said:
Mike, you'd be surprised how quick the new ceramic ball bearing, billet wheel turbos spool up. Those billet wheels are nearly weightless. Damn impressive.

This is true, but those are waaaaaayyyyyyy out of budget here. The turbos Im referring to are <300 shipped, lol

And a used S480 is 7-800 if I catch a deal.

84Ttop · Apr 18, 2013

http://www.racepartssolutions.com/products.asp?cat=124

The air to air with the 4" core has supported right up to 1000hp and was plenty good for upper 8's and street driving. This is the same inter cooler that Mike Jovanis ran in his true street car until just recently when he turned it up to around 1200rwhp and needed to upgrade.

hoopty5.0 · Apr 18, 2013

Here's the car again that I am modeling my front end off of. It makes my pants get really tight. I'd like to think I'm building the dollar store version of his, lol.

http://ls1tech.com/forums/conversions-hybrids/1229172-single-turbo-ls1-notch-build-videos-24.html

hoopty5.0 · Apr 18, 2013

84Ttop said:
http://www.racepartssolutions.com/products.asp?cat=124

The air to air with the 4" core has supported right up to 1000hp and was plenty good for upper 8's and street driving. This is the same inter cooler that Mike Jovanis ran in his true street car until just recently when he turned it up to around 1200rwhp and needed to upgrade.

Since they have an a2w listed as well, I have to ask if there is more of a benefit by running one or the other?

Seems like with the a2w you get lower IATs, denser charge, and more power...

84Ttop · Apr 18, 2013

hoopty5.0 said:
Since they have an a2w listed as well, I have to ask if there is more of a benefit by running one or the other?

Seems like with the a2w you get lower IATs, denser charge, and more power...

A2W is almost always better IMHO for the reasons you mentioned above, but there is much more expense in things like heat exchangers, pumps, surge tanks, etc and along with that come the extra weight of the additional components. I have an A2W in my car because of the benefits at my power level but In a car that makes less than 1,000 hp or so I would not think twice about running an A2A..

hoopty5.0 · Apr 24, 2013

I'm bored out of my damn mind right now. Still offshore and the project is moving at a snail's pace. Work 10 mins, wait 2 hours......

SO - figured I'd do a build cost tally and update it as I go. The "goal" of this project, if I had to set one, is 9.99+ for under $10k.

Body - $900 - $750 (part out) = $150
rear end, coilovers, wheels/tires, k member, brakes $2k
Control arms, ARB $120
K member, spare wheels $950
90/10s $185
tubs $130
front end (pipe/tube) $200
Engine $950
TH400 $100

Total: $4785 So far

When I get back:

LS6 intake $200
Used cam $~~250~~ $275
studs ~~$70~~ 66.95
HGs ~~$134~~ 100.97
Springs ~~$180~~ 139.95

Total $834
Grand total $5619

Still to buy: (* = guesstimates)

MSII $278
Harness $86
Fuses/relays, etc* $50
Turbo* $750
Converter& trans
rebuild* $1250
Fuel system* $1000
Other crap* $1000
(Other crap = WG, BOV, IC, tubing, battery cable, electrical doo-dads, etc.)

Total: $4414

Grand total: $ 10,033

With that said, I'm still trying to sell my cam and intake from my 408 build, so that should shave a few hundy off the grand total. I was generous in the still to buy section, and know that I can shave off a few more hundred around there, but might have to add in others.

I think that with some frugality, ingenuity, and a sheet-ton of psi, I can make the goal happen. The suspension should be good enough to handle ~700 hp and I know the motor/turbo can make that easily as I just saw it done on the Turbo Forums last week.

Stock 6.0, cam/springs, injectors, 80mm GT45 netted just over 600 whp through a 4l80e. this was in a chebby 2500 work truck that ran 11.90s on street tires hahahahahahahaha

No matter how fast it does/doesn't go, at least I have really good brakes on this car!, hahaha

tca7291 · Apr 24, 2013

J/K hoopty, I just saw this and it made me think of you immediately!

hoopty5.0 · Apr 25, 2013

LOL.

At least I'm using a mustang body! If money was no issue, I'd be using a 9.5 dart block. There's one for sale locally for $950, buuuuut it needs some serious machine work. A rod let go and beat the snot out of it.

Sharad · Apr 25, 2013

Understood. Brothas is broke deez dayz! (well, I am anyway)

84Ttop · Apr 26, 2013

Sharad said:
Understood. Brothas is broke deez dayz! (well, I am anyway)

I hear that! Lol I'm a member of that club...

hoopty5.0 · Apr 27, 2013

Bought the cam, 231/231 117+3 lsa. ran $25 over too. Not off to a great start here, lol. Gonna order the rest next week after I get paid.

It's actually the cam out of the car in the link from post #188 above.

Edit #2. I've been thinking it, but seeing 95bluestallion's hood thread, I've been wondering what it would be like to have and UPpipe instead DOWNpipe that flush mounts with the hood.

Or I could go super tacky and have it stick up a few inches with one of those big rig flapper things on top

CarMichael Angelo · Apr 27, 2013

hoopty5.0 said:
Bought the cam, 231/231 117+3 lsa. ran $25 over too. Not off to a great start here, lol. Gonna order the rest next week after I get paid.

It's actually the cam out of the car in the link from post #188 above.

Edit #2. I've been thinking it, but seeing 95bluestallion's hood thread, I've been wondering what it would be like to have and UPpipe instead DOWNpipe that flush mounts with the hood.

Or I could go super tacky and have it stick up a few inches with one of those big rig flapper things on top

You ain't Jokin'. The last Meth fueled car I had, the down pipes WERE up pipes, Y'd at the turbo w/ two 3"downpipes running out the holes in front of the strut towers, Vband clamped there, then turned and ran inside the top of the front fenders and exited out the bottom of the front fenders in front of the door. Several of the cars I helped build after that had their downpipes directed just about every direction you can imagine, including straight out of the hood.
I don't know if rule changes have nix'd that in NHRA,..but down here,....that's how we DEW.

hoopty5.0 · Apr 27, 2013

84Ttop - Been lookin at eBay intercoolers this morning while I "work". The A2W units are roughly $100, same for a tank. Since I'm planning on running this motor to within an inch of its life and getting as close to the 1k mark as I can, the added insurance might be worth it. Planning on a meth kit still too. If I can get my IATs as close to ambient as possible while running good fuel and tune, it might help my short block cling to life a little longer.

For the meth kit, my buddy sells fittings and pumps for oilfield stuff, so I'd get it for free if not cheap. My MS can control it with a hobbs switch so the whole system will be a drop in the bucket.

The wild card will be my ability to safely tune the MS, but baby steps....

My shift's over. Bed time. haha

84Ttop · Apr 27, 2013

hoopty5.0 said:
84Ttop - Been lookin at eBay intercoolers this morning while I "work". The A2W units are roughly $100, same for a tank. Since I'm planning on running this motor to within an inch of its life and getting as close to the 1k mark as I can, the added insurance might be worth it. Planning on a meth kit still too. If I can get my IATs as close to ambient as possible while running good fuel and tune, it might help my short block cling to life a little longer.

For the meth kit, my buddy sells fittings and pumps for oilfield stuff, so I'd get it for free if not cheap. My MS can control it with a hobbs switch so the whole system will be a drop in the bucket.

The wild card will be my ability to safely tune the MS, but baby steps....

My shift's over. Bed time. haha

I'm still not a fan of meth, and its pointless IMHO with an Intercooler. My a2w with ice in the tank has temps well below ambient. When it was in my buddies Camaro with an f2 feeding it ( pro charger has considerably higher compressor temps ) on a 90 degree day ambient IAT's were consistently in the 65-67 degree range. Remember that the better the cooler core is the better it will transfer the heat and you get what you pay for... If I was in your position I would still look to a a2a.

hoopty5.0 · Apr 28, 2013

84Ttop said:
I'm still not a fan of meth, and its pointless IMHO with an Intercooler. My a2w with ice in the tank has temps well below ambient. When it was in my buddies Camaro with an f2 feeding it ( pro charger has considerably higher compressor temps ) on a 90 degree day ambient IAT's were consistently in the 65-67 degree range. Remember that the better the cooler core is the better it will transfer the heat and you get what you pay for... If I was in your position I would still look to a a2a.

<siiiiiigh> okaaaaaay. I just wanted to be cool like you and the other big kids

haha kidding. I just want everything to be as efficient and safe for the motor as possible. But if you say A2A then that's how I'll go. I've got a lot of work ahead of me before I get to that point anyway.

Progress Thread Slow Boat To China

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mechanicus terribilis

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my rearend will smell so minty fresh,

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