Street Heat VS. Track Heat HELP! ASAP!

[Adam95GT]

Well sold my gt-40 for $175.... now i found both a street heat for $320 shipped... and a track for $350 local pick up.... What would you do on a 306 with old school trick flow street heat heads and a .510 lift cam... i think my heads will flow better at a high rpm... so i might need to make up for some down low... my car is a daily driver... but i do hit the track 2+ times a month... im thinking street heat... but the track heat is growing on me after doing some searching... let me kno asap i need to pick up one...

as of right now my build is

24 lb injectors
pro-m maf
306 block
.510 wolv. 1190 cam
Ford racing pulleys
65mm Throttlebody
energy suspension mounts
bbk shorties
H-pipe
flowmaster super 40's

I hope i can pull 300+ after a dyno tune...

 

[Adam95GT]

Chaos254 sent me this info on the heads:

hey I saw your post over at the corral and thought you'd like some info I found on the old TFS/KPI heads. This is from a post by Jay Allen a from a VERY reputable cam builder. Looks like you got atleast got some good heads out of your engine deal! here ya go....

" I worked at TFS when TFS was TFS and not an entity of summit.

The *original* TFS Street Heats set the bench mark that every single in-line Windsor head tries to reach. This is a very *political* subject that I will not get into. But there are 3 heads that fall into this category. Z-304, Canfield, TFS Street Heat. These 3 heads are it. Then there is everything else.

The *original* TFS heads said TFS on one end and KPI on the other end. Kaufman Products Incorporated was going to be the West Coast distributor and TFS was going to be the east coast distributor. That never materialized. Thus the KPI was removed.

The original heads were 180cc.
The next version was 197cc.
The current version is 200cc as I measured them. But that can fluctuate 1-2cc.

Whomever would say NOT to run these heads, simply does not have clue how good the heads are. In 1991 I went 11.47 with those heads directly OOTB. I used the monstrosity that was the TFS truck intake. A Wolverine WG-1087 cam. It weighed over 3300# with me in it. It was the ONLY car my wife and I owned. No fancy electronics. All stock. I tried a *prototype* crane interceptor but that slowed the car down. Yes I was able to shift higher, b ut it like 5900 RPM best. No fancy suspension parts. Quad shock gone. Front and rear sway bar gone. Lakewood slapper bars. Flycut pistons with an electric grinder right in the block. 11.47 at 117 mph. Remember, this was 1991. I used the FIRST Pro-M ever calibrated for 24# injectors. 26 X 10 slicks on 8" weld wheels. Looking back, that was a cluster*****. This is why I KNEW if I put Canfields on RED Death I was going 10's. I just don't understand why back in the day these heads were ALL that we had. There were NUMEROUS 11 second cars back in the day with JUNK for electronics and suspension. That stuff then would be 10's now for sure. But the intern et has come. Everyone now is engine geniuses. And 195cc heads are now *too big*. Ya right.......That is why we have 165/170cc heads. And everyone runs slower. One of these days you people will listen. Hopefully before a LS-x runs you over......."

 

[Adam95GT]

Trick flow tech info:
Adam,
The heads you have had a 186cc intake port, they could be either 1.94" or 2.02" intake valve, 1.60" exhaust valve, 20* valve angle, exhaust port raised 3/4"...

I no longer have any of the flow data from the first run (TFS/KPI) highports, sorry...

The heads you have were cast in 87-88, the first run of heads were a sand casting (green sand). When Will-Burt came into the picture the heads were converted over to a permanent mold. While the TFS/KPI & the later TFS/Will-Burt heads are pretty much identical, the KPI heads actually had the better exhaust port shape.

 

[drakesdad]

Adam...I run the Track heat and it's fine with me...and I've only been to the track with the car 4 times in 2 years.........if you look in the Summit catalogue the Track has a higher hp #........jmo fwiw........

 

[gcomfx.com]

Go big or go home. It really depends on how tight you plan to twist it.

 

[drakesdad]

and kiss the brace goodbye.....lol

 

[Adam95GT]

But my heads i think quit and cam 5.5k anyway so y would i want it 6.5k

 

[drakesdad]

I could be wrong on this Adam.....been a little while since reading my specs but I'm almost sure the Track heat and stage one for me tops at 5800 rpm.......

 

[95Mustang302]

street heat for street driving, but if your interested you should pick up the track heat and then I'll trade you plus a lil cash for the track heat upper for my street upper!!

 

[final5-0]

Adam

You have talked about a concern for a soft low end and I think that
is warranted considering this stuff is going on a daily driver.

You have listed your header choice as shortys

You have considered the track heat mid length runner upper

Those headers and that intake will both contribute to a soft low end

I'd use LT's to counter act the track heat down low
but
You still get to take advantage of its nice flow up top

Grady

 

[Adam95GT]

id rather not go with LT's should i go street heat instead??? also do you think a 65 mm throttle body will be enough or should i go 70?? i really just want to make sure my car is not all top end and doesent have the power down low...

 

[sage2k]

Why dont you want long tube headers? They are so easy to install while the motor is out of the car

I just installed the trickflow head, cam, intake, and went with a 75mm throttlebody
my car is UNTUNED and brand new throttlebody UNTOUCHED, and its very driveable

granted when coming to a stop the car wants to die, i think it has to do with running open headers and the o2's seeing fresh air
im gonna install exhaust this week and hopefully get a bit of tuning done on it and ill let you know how it runs

 

[sage2k]

also i have a street heat and it feels very torquey at the low rpm's
im running low timing and not able to fully rev the motor yet due to a maxed out mass air flow sensor

 

[cbarr300]

top-end power can be fun on the street geared appropriately.

If I were in your situation....I'd get that trackheat upper.

then if you don't like it, I'm sure someone would swap out with you.

 

[drakesdad]

id rather not go with LT's should i go street heat instead??? also do you think a 65 mm throttle body will be enough or should i go 70?? i really just want to make sure my car is not all top end and doesent have the power down low...

Adam...what brand of TB r u going with?

 

[final5-0]

id rather not go with LT's should i go street heat instead???

Adam

I know I sound like a broken record ... Sorry ... CD with a scratch that repeats
over and over ... but ... I've gathered up so many different combos that it
is very obvious to see the trends when you compare them.

At the sake of everybody having to hear it once more

LT's will give you a gain over shortys down low and at mid range

Longer length runner uppers give good low end
but
Fall off around 5K

Again ... We are generally speaking here
but
You can confidently call that a rule of thumb

also do you think a 65 mm throttle body will be enough or should i go 70??

I can't be certain as I have not seen any data about this subject that I
would call 100% valid

At this point in time
and
Until I see data that I consider to be valid .......

I have to believe the whole tb size thing needs to be considered from
two different view points.

1) WOT
2 All other driving conditions except WOT

For #1 I can see bigger could make more power
For #2 I suspect in the effort to ensure #1 is the most effective ......
One could go too far beyond a certain point and it could cause issues
some have reported such as touchy throttle, and the like.

i really just want to make sure my car is not all top end and doesent have the power down low...

I understand and agree

Pulleys can help

Spark table optimization can help

A custom cam would really go far to give you what you seek :Word:
cause
You could specify your concerns for a focus on low end torque
but
If you don't wanna heed info like has been presented here

Well ... Please Believe Me Adam ... I'm not trying to be a xxxx head here
but
Would you take the info to heart of your cam guy
cause
He can cut you a cam based upon your desires
but
You gotta work it with parts that compliment it
and
I can assure you ... he is gonna tell you about which parts to use

You see how that all kinda goes hand in hand my friend

Just trying to show

Its all about a plan

And you gotta consider all possibilities
then
Do the research to confirm the possibilities
then
Research to confirm .......
how much of a hit you are gonna take with each compromise you make

Grady

 

[Adam95GT]

I guess im gonna go track heat... ill try it out... if i dont like it ill trade it for a street heat... that should cover my ass... im also gonna stay 65 mm throttle body because i can pick one up for $70 so that aint bad for a bbk...

thanks for the help everyone

 

[95Mustang302]

good choice, if you decide you don't like the track heat I'll trade you plus cash!!!

Best of luck with the build

 

[Grn92LX]

Track heat upper, 75tb, 4.10 gears. Thats the ticket Been there/done that with the street heat intake. If I ever built a 302 again, it would NOT have a street heat on it.

 

[Pokageek]

Guys he is running 3.08's on top of all that. He is gonna have NO low end with those heads. Do what I did maybe..

#1 GO with street heat short term until you get gears.
#2 When you get gears (go with 3.90's) go with track heat and OPEN HER UP!
#3 Then sell street heat. The lower works with both.

p.s. Street heat earned me like ..15rwhp over stock and nice TQ low and DIES at 5000 fall on face. Then I went to track heat and made sonmething like ..20 MORE rwhp!