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  • 1996 - 2004 SN95 Mustang -General/Talk-
  • SN95 4.6L Mustang Tech

The quickest way to gain 40 hp

  • Thread starter Thread starter justinmanges05
  • Start date Start date Mar 18, 2010
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justinmanges05

New Member
Mar 14, 2010
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Mar 20, 2010
#21
  • Mar 20, 2010
  • #21
So..... How much boost will a stock block hold-while still keeping it reliable? And if I do that... I may as well bank on swapping the tranny too, since the TR3650 blows, right?
 

ChillPhatCat

20+ Year Stangneter
Apr 22, 2002
409
65
48
Syracuse, NY
Mar 20, 2010
#22
  • Mar 20, 2010
  • #22
justinmanges05 said:
So..... How much boost will a stock block hold-while still keeping it reliable? And if I do that... I may as well bank on swapping the tranny too, since the TR3650 blows, right?
Click to expand...

The upper limit for the block is around 400 RWHp... Probably best to dial it back to 375 RWHp to stay in safe limits. That'd be what maybe 8 lbs on a roots blower? I'd imagine the TR3650 should be fine if you're not going to be tracking the car regularly... it's rated to something like 360 Ft-lbs of torque.
 

trinity_gt

10 Year Member
Jan 31, 2003
3,125
81
99
Canada
Mar 20, 2010
#23
  • Mar 20, 2010
  • #23
My 3650 has given no trouble for me at ~390rwHP. But I also have 245-series tires and am somewhat traction limited giving the trans and rear a break. Lots of people are making way more power and torque on this transmission without trouble.

If you don't drive the thing like it's a race car you won't have to pay as if it was a race car. If 5000RPM clutch drops with slicks and full-throttle power-shifts are in the car's future, upgrade the driveline accordingly. If it's a daily driver and will be driven as such, the stock driveline parts should be fine.
 

twogts4us

15 Year Member
Apr 1, 2004
4,188
12
79
Dunedin, FL
Mar 20, 2010
#24
  • Mar 20, 2010
  • #24
Why did you buy a car with a "stupid number" for power and a transmission that "blows"?
Look dude, speak what you know, you won't win any brownie points here for posing.
TR-3650 certainly does not 'blow'. It does exactly what it was designed to do and it does it well. The 260 HP that the 2V motor produces gives you about 215 at the rear tires. If you wanted a smarter number, you should have dug a little deeper into your wallet and opted for the Mach 1 or Cobra. My guess is that your wallet wouldn't allow that, so now you're trying to play catch-up (literally and figuratively) little by little. If you want the cheapest route, go with nitrous. If you want that power to be available all the time, as stated above, you need some large dollar upgrades. Kinda makes you wish you bought the better car now doesn't it? The Mach 1 market is great right now and you can get 300 RWHP easily. I hit just over 300 (303 to be exact) with underdrive pullies, throttle body, midpipe and catback. That's it. Ahhh the joy of the 4V motor!!!
 

bhuff30

Founding Member
Dec 11, 2001
6,037
35
129
Olathe KS
Mar 20, 2010
#25
  • Mar 20, 2010
  • #25
I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Horsepower is just number. What really counts is how well the car and driver can use it. I regularly beat PI mustangs in my 97, despite being down 45hp. It's because I maintain it carefully and I can wring the most out of it. Learn to do the same in your 02 and you will have more fun. My dad and I went to the track once, he has a stock 06 GT, and I ran my 97. Despite the 85hp difference, he was only running .2s better than me. (I made some passes in the 06 and couldn't make it run faster too)

My 88 only made 306rwhp on the dyno, but it regularly beats cars with 400+hp. Yes, horsepower is just a number and it's not that meaningful.

Why not enjoy the car for what it is, and the power it has? There will always be someone with more power and deeper pockets than you. Maybe you can bring your GT to 300hp, but just remember, it is a WHOLE LOT easier for that LS1 owner to make an extra 40hp compared to you. I think you bought the wrong car. Through history, the mustang rarely has the horsepower advantage on the Camaro, but is generally the better looking car and with a little nicer fit and finish.
 

cmrocrshr

Member
Aug 14, 2009
38
1
9
Mar 20, 2010
#26
  • Mar 20, 2010
  • #26
Put gears in it first thing. That was the first thing I did in my '99 and it felt COMPLETELY different. My car was stock when I bought it 6 months ago and with the mods done in my Signature it is plenty as a daily driver.
 

oxfordgt

Member
Apr 30, 2006
288
2
18
Clarksville, TN
Mar 21, 2010
#27
  • Mar 21, 2010
  • #27
The stock 3650 is not weak at all. It stood up to my 700rwhp for almost a year and 15,000miles. I sold the tranny to a guy that now has it in his 400rwhp 2v.

If your looking for the cheapest and fastest way to make power then supercharge it. Its easier to make power then free up power with bolt ons. Nitrous is cheap at first but $50 bottle refills adds up fast.
 

ChillPhatCat

20+ Year Stangneter
Apr 22, 2002
409
65
48
Syracuse, NY
Mar 21, 2010
#28
  • Mar 21, 2010
  • #28
bhuff30 said:
I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Horsepower is just number. What really counts is how well the car and driver can use it. I regularly beat PI mustangs in my 97, despite being down 45hp. It's because I maintain it carefully and I can wring the most out of it. Learn to do the same in your 02 and you will have more fun. My dad and I went to the track once, he has a stock 06 GT, and I ran my 97. Despite the 85hp difference, he was only running .2s better than me. (I made some passes in the 06 and couldn't make it run faster too)

My 88 only made 306rwhp on the dyno, but it regularly beats cars with 400+hp. Yes, horsepower is just a number and it's not that meaningful.
Click to expand...

It does offer more SOTP feel however, even if the driver can't effectively launch it or is bad at shifting.
 

twogts4us

15 Year Member
Apr 1, 2004
4,188
12
79
Dunedin, FL
Mar 21, 2010
#29
  • Mar 21, 2010
  • #29
bhuff30 said:
1. There will always be someone with more power and deeper pockets than you.

2. Maybe you can bring your GT to 300hp, but just remember, it is a WHOLE LOT easier for that LS1 owner to make an extra 40hp compared to you.

3. I think you bought the wrong car. Through history, the mustang rarely has the horsepower advantage on the Camaro, but is generally the better looking car and with a little nicer fit and finish.
Click to expand...

Great post Brian, especially the points I quoted above...but let me add...history is changing in 2011. Long live the (new!) 5.0L!!! (I think you were generous when you said 'rarely'. Was there ever a time where the Mustang had the horsepower advantage?) But going back to the original argument, it IS just a number...you really need to factor other aspects into the total performance equation - especially vehicle weight.


ChillPhatCat said:
It does offer more SOTP feel however, even if the driver can't effectively launch it or is bad at shifting.
Click to expand...

I don't follow what you are saying. WHAT offers more SOTP feel?
 

bhuff30

Founding Member
Dec 11, 2001
6,037
35
129
Olathe KS
Mar 21, 2010
#30
  • Mar 21, 2010
  • #30
I'm not sure about the 60s and 70s, but the mustang was ahead in the horsepower wars when the original 5.0 came out, in the mid 80s through the early 90s.

twogts4us said:
I think you were generous when you said 'rarely'. Was there ever a time where the Mustang had the horsepower advantage?)
Click to expand...
 
K

Kilgore Trout

Fried or Broiled ?
10 Year Member
Mar 30, 2005
4,749
95
134
Mar 21, 2010
#31
  • Mar 21, 2010
  • #31
Lol...
 

fobnicat

New Member
Mar 21, 2010
87
0
0
Georgia
Mar 22, 2010
#32
  • Mar 22, 2010
  • #32
It's hard to say about the sixties and seventies... Most performance cars were listed with false hp ratings by the manufacturer because insurance companies began increasing rates on cars over 300hp.... Tricky jokers
 

ChillPhatCat

20+ Year Stangneter
Apr 22, 2002
409
65
48
Syracuse, NY
Mar 22, 2010
#33
  • Mar 22, 2010
  • #33
twogts4us said:
I don't follow what you are saying. WHAT offers more SOTP feel?
Click to expand...

More Horsepower... I quoted your post which was all about horsepower.

More power = more acceleration when you're not burning rubber or shifting poorly. Whether you run a scalding quarter mile time for what you have or not, the car with a better power to weight ratio will give you more SOTP feel. Power does matter in that regard.
 

Modular2v

Founding Member
Jun 30, 2002
3,222
23
99
oklahoma
Mar 22, 2010
#34
  • Mar 22, 2010
  • #34
WallyKilla said:
You are going to need more than 300 flywheel horse to beat LS1 powered camaros. They have a very nice top end. I would spray a 75 shot You will gain 75 horse and even more torque.
Click to expand...

i have beat them with 263rwhp
 

Tripoli

Member
Mar 30, 2005
208
0
16
Dallas, TX
Mar 22, 2010
#35
  • Mar 22, 2010
  • #35
My best friend drives a 2002 TransAM WS6, and I've been chasing him for 5 years now. Bone stock, he got 13.2s in the quarter mile. Here's what I had done to my 2002 GT when I finally broke the 13.2 mark:

Long tube headers and off-road exhaust
4.10 gears
Underdrive pulleys
Cold air intake
75mm throttle body and intake plenum
Stage II cams and valve springs
Custom tune
Drag radials

That made 289 RWHP.

I still lost to most LS1 cars I raced, though. Everyone who owns one knows they can get 50 more RWHP with just a cam and a tune. You want to beat one? Do what I finally did: Get a supercharger.
 

bhuff30

Founding Member
Dec 11, 2001
6,037
35
129
Olathe KS
Mar 22, 2010
#36
  • Mar 22, 2010
  • #36
It's fun to beat LS1 cars.

This is me eating a Firebird: P1010075.flv video by bhuff66062 - Photobucket
 

ChillPhatCat

20+ Year Stangneter
Apr 22, 2002
409
65
48
Syracuse, NY
Mar 22, 2010
#37
  • Mar 22, 2010
  • #37
bhuff30 said:
It's fun to beat LS1 cars.

This is me eating a Firebird: P1010075.flv video by bhuff66062 - Photobucket
Click to expand...

That sure looks like an LT1... a fast one, but an LT1 nonetheless.
 
P

peepeeskillz

New Member
Mar 23, 2009
171
0
0
texas
Mar 23, 2010
#38
  • Mar 23, 2010
  • #38
ChillPhatCat said:
That sure looks like an LT1... a fast one, but an LT1 nonetheless.
Click to expand...

yea i have to agree thats an LT1, but still faster than my car!
 

ChillPhatCat

20+ Year Stangneter
Apr 22, 2002
409
65
48
Syracuse, NY
Mar 23, 2010
#39
  • Mar 23, 2010
  • #39
peepeeskillz said:
yea i have to agree thats an LT1, but still faster than my car!
Click to expand...


Yeah... mine too.
 
J

Jbauer

New Member
Jan 20, 2008
506
0
0
Mar 23, 2010
#40
  • Mar 23, 2010
  • #40
im making 265HP 301 TQ dynod at MPH in atlanta.. i think that may be close to 300 crank.

Flowmaster Catback
O/R H pipe
Accufab plenum
75mm throttle body
K&N FIPKII intake
DIablo tuner (which sucks, i have SCT now so i may b making more power)

then i added things like GEars, short shifter, HAWK brakes and stuff to make it more fun..all in all.. this things pretty frikin fast man..when i floor it people are always in awe...i mean..maybe im just easy to please but i am VERY happy with my mustangs performance..but maybe thats because i upgraded from a 115 HP jetta..my stang feels like a rocket..and i run mid 13s day and night on a piss poor track.

in about 6 months i'm gonna put some pulleys on her to see what that does. a lot of ppl online say they dont do much but all my friends in person say they made a VERY noticeable gain. ALL my friends said the pulleys made an even bigger difference than a tuner.
 
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