Engine 93 lx top end kit install now has no power.

AeroCoupe · Aug 21, 2023

Two ways. Pull the passenger valve cover and watch the intake rocker. Second way is here and Post #22:

Engine - Can't get the motor to fire.

Pretty much anytime someone has the distributor out, does internal engine work that involves rotating the engine, and then it won’t start when all back together is because the distributor is 180* out. Ask me how I know lol.

stangnet.com

For me it’s a MFer pulling the passenger side valve cover so I use a positive stop device. Carbureted motor it’s typically easier to pull the valve cover.

mikestang63 · Aug 22, 2023

did you use the correct length pushrods and adjust the valve lash properly
is the timing chain and gears installed properly-did you degree the cam
is the distributor phased properly
is the TFI plug in- if not that will lock out the timing and not allow advance

I would advance the timing to 16 or so and take it out on a spin,,, see if you get any detonation or not.

anorth93 · Aug 22, 2023

mikestang63 said:
did you use the correct length pushrods and adjust the valve lash properly
is the timing chain and gears installed properly-did you degree the cam
is the distributor phased properly
is the TFI plug in- if not that will lock out the timing and not allow advance

I would advance the timing to 16 or so and take it out on a spin,,, see if you get any detonation or not.

Ya I ordered the entire trick flow 11r top end kit came with everything. Ya timing chain and everything is dot to dot. Didn't degree the cam just put it in with the dots matching. The timing chain I have is just like the factory one. I haven't changed anything on the distributor pulled it, put the top end kit on and drop it back in at tdc. And yes tfi is plugged in. I already tried 16 degrees no change. Even locked it out at 28 and 30. Still no power

General karthief · Aug 23, 2023

What do you mean by 'no power' ?
Nevermind I went back and read the post again, my thoughts are a timing/advance issue.
have you checked that the computer is advancing (controlling) the timing?

anorth93 · Aug 23, 2023

General karthief said:
What do you mean by 'no power' ?
Nevermind I went back and read the post again, my thoughts are a timing/advance issue.
have you checked that the computer is advancing (controlling) the timing?

Ya I've done that too. Put the spout back in and had the wife rev it and it's advancing. It's really weird. The normal things you would think they are I have check and all that seems to be working right. I still have to put the AFR gauge in. I just haven't had a chance due to work. But I'm sure that will help figure something out. The only thing I haven't replaced is the actual distributor itself and the TFI module. Before the top end kit the car ran better then it ever has, So it's not like I had issues before ripping it apart.

anorth93 · Aug 23, 2023

General karthief said:
What do you mean by 'no power' ?
Nevermind I went back and read the post again, my thoughts are a timing/advance issue.
have you checked that the computer is advancing (controlling) the timing?

I have a brand new Holley Terminator x sitting in the box. I just didn't want to go through and install all that right now. If I didn't have to. I bought that for down the road when I do a stroker motor with a supercharger or turbo. But if I can't figure it out that could always be an option. Then I could at least data log and figure something. I did the valves three different times to make sure they were good because it was my first time doing a hydraulic roller. So if anything I figured they would be a little loose. Not tight. But hypothetically speaking, let's say one or two of the cylinders work too tight. Would that cause all the spark plugs to foul out or would that just cause the cylinders that weren't adjusted right to foul

LILCBRA · Aug 23, 2023

anorth93 said:
So what would be the easiest way to check if it's at tdc with the motor together. I know to put my finger over the hole to make sure it's on the compression stroke, but how do I make sure the piston is at top dead center without using a bore scope camera. I'm going to put the AFR gauge in tonight and fresh plugs and then I will re-stab the distributor. I tried 10° 12, 14, 16 and then locked the timing out at 28 and 30 still no change

Maybe you're beyond this point, but a quick check that I was taught years ago and is similar to what you've described was to pull the #1 plug and stuff something like a rag or some wadded up paper towel into the hole to create a seal. Bump the key until the rag/paper pops/shoots out. That'll tell you that you're on or just beyond the compression stroke and near TDC. It would be a good idea to pull the distributor cap and check the orientation of the rotor when you do that. It's a quick, non-invasive check to ensure that the distributor is installed in the correct orientation and it's guaranteed to not fire when bumping the key. Since it's fuel injected, it probably wouldn't be a bad idea to pull the fuse or otherwise disable the pump circuit when you do that too.

(Edited for clarity.)

anorth93 · Aug 24, 2023

LILCBRA said:
Maybe you're beyond this point, but a quick check that I was taught years ago and is similar to what you've described was to pull the #1 plug and stuff something like a rag or some wadded up paper towel into the hole to create a seal. Bump the key until the rag/paper pops/shoots out. That'll tell you that you're on or just beyond the compression stroke and near TDC. It would be a good idea to pull the distributor cap and check the orientation of the rotor when you do that. It's a quick, non-invasive check to ensure that the distributor is installed in the correct orientation and it's guaranteed to not fire when bumping the key. Since it's fuel injected, it probably wouldn't be a bad idea to pull the fuse or otherwise disable the pump circuit when you do that too.

(Edited for clarity.)

Ya I have done that already. Except I did it with all the plugs out and turned it over by hand. Once I knew it was on the compression stroke Everything was lined up perfect. Pointing right at number one

vindieseljetta · Aug 26, 2023

What brand are the new injectors?

anorth93 · Aug 26, 2023

vindieseljetta said:
What brand are the new injectors?

Bosch 24lb

Sunshine Guy · Aug 26, 2023

1. Idles well and runs okay under light load
2. Weak power under heavy load

Especially given all the other things you've already checked, this could be a fuel delivery problem. While you have observed correct fuel pressure at low fuel demand, a lack of volume capability caused by a clogged fuel filter, pinched or dented fuel line, fuel coupler leak inside the gas tank, etc. could be the culprit.

Can you observe fuel pressure with the engine under heavy load? Insufficient available volume would show up as a drop in fuel pressure ONLY when under heavy load.

Sunshine Guy · Aug 26, 2023

Another possibility would be incorrect calibration of your new mass air meter. Unlikely, but it does happen. Might have been calibrated to 19 lb. injectors but accidentally/errantly labeled for 24 lb.

You indicated your plugs suggest an overly rich mixture which would indeed reduce power under load. You tried to eliminate the new MAF meter as a possible cause by installing the old meter. However, your old one is calibrated for 19 lb. injectors which would over-fuel the engine somewhat with your current 24 lb. injectors (even after allowing for the maximum % of closed loop correction). So if your new meter was actually over-fueling you wouldn't necessarily seen a performance improvement with installation of the old, 19 lb. meter.

I would expect the EEC-IV computer to jump to open loop when you are trying to make a "power pull" which should disengage input from the MAF meter for air/fuel calculations. However, there are enough potential variables at play here that a bad MAF calibration might be causing problems.

Getting your air/fuel ratio gauge installed will be a big help with diagostics.

vindieseljetta · Aug 26, 2023

Ah thanks. I just bought some Accel injectors that seem to get mixed reviews. Bosch should be solid .

anorth93 · Aug 26, 2023

Sunshine Guy said:
Another possibility would be incorrect calibration of your new mass air meter. Unlikely, but it does happen. Might have been calibrated to 19 lb. injectors but accidentally/errantly labeled for 24 lb.

You indicated your plugs suggest an overly rich mixture which would indeed reduce power under load. You tried to eliminate the new MAF meter as a possible cause by installing the old meter. However, your old one is calibrated for 19 lb. injectors which would over-fuel the engine somewhat with your current 24 lb. injectors (even after allowing for the maximum % of closed loop correction). So if your new meter was actually over-fueling you wouldn't necessarily seen a performance improvement with installation of the old, 19 lb. meter.

I would expect the EEC-IV computer to jump to open loop when you are trying to make a "power pull" which should disengage input from the MAF meter for air/fuel calculations. However, there are enough potential variables at play here that a bad MAF calibration might be causing problems.

Getting your air/fuel ratio gauge installed will be a big help with diagostics.

Ya I can hook the fuel pressure gauge up to an AN line and put it where I can see it while putting it under a load. The fuel pump and everything inside is about a year old. I know that doesn't necessarily mean anything anymore with how parts are now a days. But I will check that today, and just picked up the new welder to put my AFR in. Other one took a crap. I will get back with you guys this afternoon. Heading to the track with the new roush supercharged single cab 5.0 F-150 to try and see what it'll do then I'll get back working on the car

AeroCoupe · Aug 26, 2023

Does the car still have the factory fuel pressure regulator? It’s almost like it’s dumping fuel when the vacuum goes down.

anorth93 · Aug 26, 2023

AeroCoupe said:
Does the car still have the factory fuel pressure regulator? It’s almost like it’s dumping fuel when the vacuum goes down.

Ya it does never had issues with it before so I never changed it. And I ran the crap out of the car. It's been sprayed with a 125 shot probably 100 times , and ran amazing before the top end kit

Monkeybutt2000 · Aug 26, 2023

anorth93 said:
Ya it does never had issues with it before so I never changed it. And I ran the crap out of the car. It's been sprayed with a 125 shot probably 100 times , and ran amazing before the top end kit

Pull the vacumn hose to the regulator and see if it smells like fuel.

anorth93 · Sep 21, 2023

Monkeybutt2000 said:
Pull the vacumn hose to the regulator and see if it smells like fuel.

Sorry guys been awhile had a family emergency almost lost my father, so haven't been able to work on the car much. I got the AFR gauge installed and it's bouncing from 14.2 All the way to 19.1 I also did the cylinder balance test three times and it's showing code 60 which I'm assuming is cylinder six. I checked the fuel pressure regulator. I even primed the system and put a vacuum pump on top of the regulator to see if it was stuck in fuel and it wasn't. Stuck a fuel pressure gauge on at wallets idling and when I stomp the gas fuel pressure drops about two to three pounds then goes right back to 40.

Mustang5L5 · Sep 21, 2023

yes, cylinder 6 is not contributing. Gotta check spark, fuel and compression on that cylinder.

anorth93 · Sep 24, 2023

Mustang5L5 said:
yes, cylinder 6 is not contributing. Gotta check spark, fuel and compression on that cylinder.

Spark was fine put a spark tester on it and was good. The car ran great before so I know the rings and pistons are fine. I'm gonna compression test it tomorrow. Maybe I have the valves jacked up on that cylinder. How can I test the fuel injector to see if it's working like it should? I know that one primes atleast It did before when I put them in because I had an issue with 5 and 6 before I had bad injectors. Got new ones 5 isn't showing issues but now 6 is

Engine 93 lx top end kit install now has no power.

lube between the nut and the face. I know my lubes

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wonder how much it would cost to ship you a pair

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I wish I didn't have all of these balls in the air

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lube between the nut and the face. I know my lubes

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Mustang Master

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That is…until I whipped out my Bissell

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