bleeding brakes on a 89 topaz, need help. wtf??

gingerbreadman · Sep 4, 2006

Ya so the GBM got tired of 10 mpg at $5 a gallon up here in nannookville so he bought himself a gem of gas sipper, 89 mercury topaz, 4cyl 5 speed 118,000 kilometers (70,000 miles?) anyways car is decent i went through it and fixed a few things (tie rod end, cv joint boot, o2 senser and front brakes) im all ready to go again on it here but i cant get the brakes to bleed.

It has a master cyl with 4 lines coming off it goin straight to each wheel, no proportioning valve?

i have bled and bled and no air, no fluid, no pedal, no nothing, i could only reach the 2 lines on the master cyl on the side going to the front brakes i pulled them off and no fluid coming out of them, i rigged up some hoses and bench bled them but still no go, I cant reach the bottom lines untill i get my line wrenches from work tommorow. ill try bench bleeding all 4 lines then but in the meantime im stumped, the haynes manuel just explains conventional bleeding methods.

anyone?

-gbm-

MitchGT · Sep 4, 2006

Does your car have ABS? That might change a few things.

gingerbreadman · Sep 4, 2006

MitchGT said:
Does your car have ABS? That might change a few things.

its not abs

-gbm-

2nd Mustang · Sep 4, 2006

While pumping brake pedal, look into MC reservoir and see if there is a fountain of brake fluid spitting up into the reservoir. If there is, most likely the piston seals on the reservoir push rod are shot causing fluid to back up into reservoir and not into the lines. Good luck and welcome back.

gingerbreadman · Sep 5, 2006

2nd Mustang said:
While pumping brake pedal, look into MC reservoir and see if there is a fountain of brake fluid spitting up into the reservoir. If there is, most likely the piston seals on the reservoir push rod are shot causing fluid to back up into reservoir and not into the lines. Good luck and welcome back.

It does do that,

are you sure this is a sign of a faulty m/c? I have scene several masters do this before and the brakes were working fine before i tore them apart except for a stuck caliper and warped rotors.

-gbm-

jcode68 · Sep 5, 2006

gingerbreadman said:
It does do that,
are you sure this is a sign of a faulty m/c? I have scene several masters do this before and the brakes were working fine before i tore them apart except for a stuck caliper and warped rotors.
-gbm-

MC's will do this anyway, I believe when you release the brake pedal. This is not a sign of a bad MC from my experience. Only thing that comes to mind is to remove the MC and bench bleed it to check that it works properly. While it's out, you could remove the lines at each wheel and blow them out with compressed air to make sure there isn't anything plugging them. Other than that, it's a head scratcher...

LMan · Sep 5, 2006

No tech to add, just marveling at the words..

"89 Topaz"

yeloxr7 · Sep 5, 2006

Don't scoff, LMan, theyare not bad cars. I wish I still had either my 86 or 87 (sport package) Tempo back. The 86 (5-speed GL 4-door) could get 40 MPG at 80 MPH.

I have an 89 Topaz too and it is a pain to bleed it. It can be done though. There are brass adapters two of the master cylinder outlets (can't remember if they are for the front or rear lines) that can cause problems. I had to switch them with a set from a spare MC to get the system to work properly.

I tried to bleed the brakes by myself but ended up with mushy pedal, so I had my wife or one of the kids help and was able to get it done.

Rusty67 · Sep 5, 2006

AllData wants to know if it is a FWD or AWD ? Also X or S vin code.... not sure if that makes a difference. I can look it up and tell you if there is anything special that needs to be done to bleed it out properly.

2nd Mustang · Sep 5, 2006

gingerbreadman said:
...i have bled and bled and no air, no fluid, no pedal, no nothing,
-gbm-

If no fluid is coming out of the lines to the wheels and you have no brake pedal pressure, that would account for the fluid going back into the reservoir via a faulty MC or the lines are really plugged with junk, but then again, if the lines were plugged, you should feel some pedal pressure, you just wouldn't have any brakes.

gingerbreadman · Sep 6, 2006

Ok, I got my line wrenches from work today and pulled the master cyl right out, i bench bled it and still it wouldnt bleed, I priced out a master cyl ($40) so I went on down and bought one, i bench bled that one (it acted tottaly different then the old one on the bench) i installed it and after a little effort i got all the wheels to bleed and she runs and drives and BRAKES great!!

I dont know if the old master was at fault but it appears that way, the old fluid was very dirty and grity due to the wrong seal being on the cap. i wonder if when i pulled the calipers off it let the fluid go down and let some dirt into the master and scored it up or pluged it up?

anyways i hate being a "parts changer" mechanic but in this case i didnt have much choice and it appears i was right.

long live the topaz

-gbm-

gingerbreadman · Sep 6, 2006

yeloxr7 said:
Don't scoff, LMan, theyare not bad cars. I wish I still had either my 86 or 87 (sport package) Tempo back. The 86 (5-speed GL 4-door) could get 40 MPG at 80 MPH.

I have an 89 Topaz too and it is a pain to bleed it. It can be done though. There are brass adapters two of the master cylinder outlets (can't remember if they are for the front or rear lines) that can cause problems. I had to switch them with a set from a spare MC to get the system to work properly.

I tried to bleed the brakes by myself but ended up with mushy pedal, so I had my wife or one of the kids help and was able to get it done.

The brass adapters are the proportioning valves for the rear brakes they are mounted on the bottom of the master. the side lines go to the front brakes, the new master cyl didnt come with new proportioning valves I had to swap them over.

just some FYI

-gbm-

yeloxr7 · Sep 6, 2006

Yup. That's what I had to do with the proportioning valves. My experience was opposite of yours. The replacement master didn't work properly, so I installed one I had on hand from the wrecking yard. I had so many problems (leaks etc.) I replaced all the hydraulic components on the car.

bleeding brakes on a 89 topaz, need help. wtf??

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