Exorcising a '78

2Blue2

will be trying this sex one when I can find it
Mar 5, 2019
1,915
1,100
123
52
Oahu
I like your wheel tire combo/stance, Just the right street sweeping stance.

I cut 1.5 coils off my stock 65 coils and it was super low (and soft)
When I switched to the Shelby 1 inch front lowering springs it raised my car 1.5 inches.
 
  • Like
Reactions: LILCBRA
  • Sponsors(?)


IICrew

Active Member
Mar 29, 2020
73
64
28
USA
Are you guys happy with the handling? Is the ride too rough/too soft? What weight springs are you running? Would you do it differently now that you have lived with your setup?

Even though handling is my priority. I am 50+ with several spine surgeries in my past and want to drive it on longer trips so comfort has to be considered. I have 215/60/14 up front and have already rolled the fender a little and flattened that pinch weld. I cannot go lower without scraping on the rutted country roads and railroad crossings around here. My engine guy was shocked how banged up the oil pan was. Being in the midwest the roads never last. Having leadfootitis and a lot of hilly roads to explore doesn't help.

I love my current stance but it rides like crap with factory bushings and ball joints. It has v6 springs and caster is way out so control arms need addressed sooner than I was hoping.

Again thanks for any advice.
 

LILCBRA

I started this morning by knocking out some studs
10 Year Member
Dec 6, 2005
1,988
1,025
154
48
Marietta, Ga
I ended up asking for 4 cylinder springs when I ordered mine from a parts store years ago. I couldn't tell you the weight ratings or whatever of what I have, but I asked for them because I intended on cutting them AND I was installing the engine I have now which has Trick Flow heads.

As far as the ride goes, I don't think it's too bad at all really. I mean they used "soft" springs to begin with so I don't think you'd notice it being much more of a harsh ride than it is now.

And I can totally relate to the banged up oil pan and Midwestern roads. I'm from NE Iowa and way back in high school I was driving my II all year. One winter I ended up bottoming the car out, hit the pan on something and somehow threw a rod. I obviously didn't drive the car during the rest of that winter, but it made me abandon driving it the following winters as well. I considered it a very expensive lesson learned.
 

IICrew

Active Member
Mar 29, 2020
73
64
28
USA
4 cyl springs you say? hmmm. Your happy with the handling? What sway bars do you have?

Maybe I should replace the control arms and strut rod bushings then add the rear and bigger front sway bar before I condemn the v6 springs. I do like the current almost flat ride height. It is harsh now but I attribute that to binding and dry rotten bushings. If I am complaining it's harsh why start with stiffer springs?

I have headers, aluminum heads, intake , water pump and the battery is in the spare tire well. I plan on getting the mid tucked bumper one day to shed more weight off the front axle. I haven't weighed it but I should be down around v6 weight if not below by a few pounds.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2Blue2

extra_stout

Active Member
Aug 27, 2018
225
191
53
Germany
About spring rates I have this link put into my link collection:
https://www.stangnet.com/mustang-forums/threads/front-springs.739970/#post-7368264

The engine+ transmission weight of a windsor 302 with T5 is very close to a V6 with a C4. 302 weight about 100 lbs more than a V6. C4 to T5 is around 50 lbs.
If you take your heads into account... not much difference.
I swapped from V8 to V6 and I kept the V6 spring. It sits at the moment very high (fuel tank, exhaust system and most of the interior is still missing tough).
2blue2 also reworked his suspension and the car was after that a little bit higher.
My advice: keep the v6 spring and rebuild your suspension (don't forget a new spring insulator). If the car sits after setteling still to high, borrow a good spring compressor and cut it in small steps to the right size. A good spring compressor makes the difference...
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2Blue2

LILCBRA

I started this morning by knocking out some studs
10 Year Member
Dec 6, 2005
1,988
1,025
154
48
Marietta, Ga
4 cyl springs you say? hmmm. Your happy with the handling? What sway bars do you have?

.....

I have headers, aluminum heads, intake , water pump and the battery is in the spare tire well. I plan on getting the mid tucked bumper one day to shed more weight off the front axle. I haven't weighed it but I should be down around v6 weight if not below by a few pounds.
I don't have a rear sway bar and the front is the stocker, 7/8" I believe. And my setup is almost identical except my battery is still in the stock location. I weighed my car years ago at a grain elevator. They must've forgotten to turn their scales off overnight. :shrug: But with me in the car it come to around 2900 pounds if I remember correctly.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2Blue2

2Blue2

will be trying this sex one when I can find it
Mar 5, 2019
1,915
1,100
123
52
Oahu
0n my 65 with 1.5 coils cut, I was never happy with how it rode or dragged on gutters and speed bumps.
Very harsh always hitting the bump stop.
On the 77 r all the worn bushings getting replaced made it sit up a bit. I am now contemplating pulling the urethane bushings out of the front.
I'm already tired of the creaking and groaning. The Cobra came with front and rear sway bars.

You got back problems just rebuild to stock specs.
In the real world roads are harsh.
 

LILCBRA

I started this morning by knocking out some studs
10 Year Member
Dec 6, 2005
1,988
1,025
154
48
Marietta, Ga
I am now contemplating pulling the urethane bushings out of the front.
I'm already tired of the creaking and groaning.
Gotsta grease them up! I used polyurethane and had the same problem. Didn't pay attention to the instructions when I threw it together, but they need greased or they will squeek and creak....
 

2Blue2

will be trying this sex one when I can find it
Mar 5, 2019
1,915
1,100
123
52
Oahu
They got greased with the stuff they sent just for that. but still not so great here we are a few months later and they need it again.
If i'm taking it apart to grease them, then I'm putting the high durometer rubber in instead.
 
  • Like
Reactions: LILCBRA

IICrew

Active Member
Mar 29, 2020
73
64
28
USA
Waiting on front suspension stuff to arrive. Keeping stock coils for now. The ancient bushings have not fared well in the little driving I have done.

Had dual exhaust installed today. Used a single Cherry Bomb Vortex dual in/out muffler. I was not looking for the quiet girl in the corner. Nor did I intend to have the drunk obnoxious gal dancing on the bar. Alas here we are.
She sounds vicious. Like she missed last call and is just getting warmed up. Demanding everyone's attention. Just pissed off and rearing to go. 18 y/o me would have loved it. I am not so sure if today's me is ready for all the attention. lol


Here is a progress pic since I haven't posted one recently.
IMG_20200609_162551754.jpg
 

LILCBRA

I started this morning by knocking out some studs
10 Year Member
Dec 6, 2005
1,988
1,025
154
48
Marietta, Ga
You could take the path I did and what @extra_stout suggested in my A/F thread. I was happy with how my car sounded but wanted to quiet it down. I ended up installing a pair of glass packs upstream of the mufflers and it helped quite a bit. In my case, the glass packs are about 4-1/2" in diameter and I run 2-1/2" pipes, so they don't really take away much more ground clearance than without. I'm pretty happy that I finally did it after wrestling with the idea for a few years....

IMG_20200425_102338.jpg
IMG_20200425_102357.jpg
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2Blue2

IICrew

Active Member
Mar 29, 2020
73
64
28
USA
I have been lurking on your A/F thread. Just installed one with the exhaust and found out I am running pretty rich. Getting the tune kit and learning to fine tune the eddy carb is on the to do list but I have to be able to brake without diving into a ditch first.

Tomorrow I will get her back on jack stands. Saw some leaks while they had her in the air and I still have to install a shorter trans mount. It continues to shake itself apart above 55. I tried getting the exhaust guy to do it today but it took way longer than he anticipated as it was. The owner and the tech who did it said these are the hardest car to get duals over the axle.

Once these problems are addressed I am probably copying you. It just needs to be toned down but I like the sound.

I had tips but they were too long. For now it's unfinished but so are most things in my world.

IMG_20200609_162634899.jpg
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2Blue2 and LILCBRA

extra_stout

Active Member
Aug 27, 2018
225
191
53
Germany
This Vortex Dual In/out should be very similar to an x-pipe I would think… So right and left side are connected?! Can you confirm that by looking inside?
There are a few options what you could do:
- install a valve in one of the tailpipes, that flow must exist only one tip if closed (that was my initial plan on my build: eat the cake and also have it with a button)
- install a DB killer in both tailpipes
- install glasspacks upfront (as LILCBRA did)

I started this week also to build the exhaust. And the tight space around the axle is really a bummer. I kept the old exhaust and did install it again to see how things are looking… I initially planned to do some 2,5'' over axles and use also a similar style muffler (flow trough design with x pipe). Now I'm going the LILCBRA design with option to swap the old over axle pipes in if i get in trouble with law :cool:
At the weekend there will be some TIG action and picture will follow.

I would love to here your car. I posted a YouTube link in my thread where a explorer is running such an exhaust and it sounds awesome with the crackling and rough sound.

You said you like this sound, than try the valve or the DB killer. The DB killer can be done by the muffler shop. Just use a smaller diameter pipe (something around 2 inch, if you have a 2,5 inch exhaust). They should be positioned in the tailpipes, so check which length can be put into the tailpipe and cut this pipe to this lenght. Both ends than needs to be widened so that the outer diameter feeds flush into the inner diameter of the tailpipe. Secure them with a screw if installed permanently.
I would try to keep the tailpipes clamped on, not welded on (in every build) to try different options.
You can also try how the closed valve will sound, if you just put a closed pipe into on exit of the mufflers.

I would love to here our car and also see pictures of the exhaust.
 

IICrew

Active Member
Mar 29, 2020
73
64
28
USA
My request was similar to stock exhaust outlets, run in 2.5" and able to remove the pipes near the transmission easily while on jack stands. They ran 2.5" header to the axle, added a flange then had to go 2 1/4 over the axle and directly into the muffler which is in the stock location. I bought nice 8" tips but they stuck too far out and we went with normal pipes till I find shorter tips I like

Looking into the muffler you can see straight through the inlet/outlet on the same side but cannot see light from the other side. They are separated by a perforated baffle and what looks like fiberglass packing. There should be some equalization but.... I imagine it's sorda kinda an x pipe but not a true free flowing x pipe.

I will have it on jack stands tomorrow and can snap some pics then. Today is fixing other stuff, avoid tropical storm remnants and mowing day if I can. grrrr. I took a video yesterday but it's still "processing " 16 hours later according to google photos so I cant upload it yet. My phone does okay video quality but the mic is horrendous for exhaust. I've taken several videos and they sound like crap so expectations should be tempered. I had a nice camera that did 1080 video but my better half decided my kid needed it more. Needless to say it is now MIA. lol
 

IICrew

Active Member
Mar 29, 2020
73
64
28
USA
Non Pro Tip: If you replace the rear glass make sure they or you install the rubber u channel interior molding first. It's just rubber u channel that covers the interior metal lip on the glass opening on hatch. When they did mine I ass-u-me-d they knew what they were doing and failed to do my own diligent research. My rear glass is settling in the heat. Inside the butyle is oozing out. It now has a 1/4 gap between the glass and exterior trim that was not present before sitting in the sun a few hours. I expect over time the glass will be touching the metal lip on the inside. I will need to get the proper u channel and probably pay to have it redone and hope they don't break my glass in the process since they are no longer available new. If someone else is doing work on these cars you have to know the proper steps because I have found repeatedly that they do not.
 

extra_stout

Active Member
Aug 27, 2018
225
191
53
Germany
Looking into the muffler you can see straight through the inlet/outlet on the same side but cannot see light from the other side. They are separated by a perforated baffle and what looks like fiberglass packing. There should be some equalization but.... I imagine it's sorda kinda an x pipe but not a true free flowing x pipe.
Okay, that is not enough for half of the exhaust flow. And the idea with the valve is not the right one for this muffler.