I'd also like to point out that my engine issue might not have had anything to do with the turbo... I think it had everything to do with the guy who slapped it all together and thought he knew what he was doing!
Build Thread 1978 Mercury Cyclone. The pig is in the pen.
- Status
-
Sponsors (?)
And you hit the nail on the head......I was trending towards turning it up, and up.
I know me....I know human nature....if there's a cookie and a glass of milk on the shelf with a sign that reads
"EAT ME!"
That cookies gone.
Having 7 p.s.i. (gate pressure) would last as long as it takes to re-enable an adjustable boost controller..it would go exactly like it did the last time....
7 gave way to 10,...10 eeekd up to 12.
I was planning on a 15 psi tune when I got this engine back together,...and now that there's an MLS head gasket in the mix,...15 would soon become 18....
The fix is to remove the cookie from the shelf.
tune in to the Electric Company, when hoopty5.0 asks
" will Mike have as much fun without Gary the Borg Warner Snail?"
hoopty5.0
The only consulation for having Blown engine rod bearing loss....is Chiilin' out in Montana with dental floss...
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ialhaxhr7iA
If you didn't spend the 8 minutes and 39 seconds watching that, it loops into Cosmik Debris.
As long as detonation is downgraded to an adjudicated delinquent act, and stopped from going feral, the critical loads are less with supercharged or turboed engines.
I'm not sure what the exact stats are on engines that are turboed, Ford and GM Holden Australia would know, because they direct comparisons between turbo, supercharged and normally aspirated cars.
A turbo or supercharged engine is always making a heck of a lot more torque off idle to the mid range, though.
Naturally aspirated horspower for boosted horspower, the crititcal breaking rod loads are certainly lower than if you try and make them scream to make the same power. The only exception is in burnouts, donughts, drifting and in give and take public road driving.
Ford Australia, for instance, found that the TopLoader 4 speed liked to fuse its gears on the mainshaft un certain race conditions, but cars driven on public roads out in Western Australia had a huge number of waranty claims becasue they were used behind 250, 302 and 351 cars that could cruise at 80 mph in third gear, and in the bulldust of outback roads, you could spend all day in thrid gear.
The problem's that never happen except in race conditions then migrate to thermal stress on the road, what people think are rod bearing and main bearing issues...they are normally incipent detonation issues.Thats detonation you can't detect.
So bearing finish, linishing sufaces and all that jazz becomes the critical stuff. When people upgrade the conrods, then the problems then become wrist pins and rod and main bearing failure.
This I have leaned from my friends Torana SL/Turbo 3300. Down here in the late 1987 before the share market crash, we Kiwis were frequntly in a rich farming community, and everyone was building there own V8 Holdens and Fords. For one guy, he wanted a Normalair Garret Torana.
You take a stock 3.3 in line six, rebuild it with the best forged Starfire/Bathurst con rods, solid skirt XU1 pistons, clearance it, linish and crack test the parts then add 12 pounds of boost, and the engine survives. Untill his girlfriend Vivan Peck takes it out on a regular basis, and give it a moderate thrashing. From Alexandra to Omakau and back for school each day, a road to die for, full of trucks and give and take zones, so its on and off the gas all the time at 45 to 70 mph all the time. Then it breaks, so he blames his gurl. It broke because of a wrist pin failure that you don't ever see in un boosted engines. The loads to break a wrist pin are H-U-G-E, but 0.866" Holden and BMW and Nissan wrist pins are quite small, and they become critical loads.
Anyway, this is a lot like the Cemical Supercharging nitrous oxide issue. You transfer other problem with engines to lean out related torchdown matters.
I'm not sure if going back to naturally aspirated will look after con rods, but we all assume not having boost will give the engine an easier life. Revs kill engines. If the Monsta its driven like it was, it'll need to be trashed a little more in the mid range unless some trick intake mods are done.
" will Mike have as much fun without Gary the Borg Warner Snail?"
hoopty5.0
The only consulation for having Blown engine rod bearing loss....is Chiilin' out in Montana with dental floss...
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ialhaxhr7iA
If you didn't spend the 8 minutes and 39 seconds watching that, it loops into Cosmik Debris.
As long as detonation is downgraded to an adjudicated delinquent act, and stopped from going feral, the critical loads are less with supercharged or turboed engines.
I'm not sure what the exact stats are on engines that are turboed, Ford and GM Holden Australia would know, because they direct comparisons between turbo, supercharged and normally aspirated cars.
A turbo or supercharged engine is always making a heck of a lot more torque off idle to the mid range, though.
Naturally aspirated horspower for boosted horspower, the crititcal breaking rod loads are certainly lower than if you try and make them scream to make the same power. The only exception is in burnouts, donughts, drifting and in give and take public road driving.
Ford Australia, for instance, found that the TopLoader 4 speed liked to fuse its gears on the mainshaft un certain race conditions, but cars driven on public roads out in Western Australia had a huge number of waranty claims becasue they were used behind 250, 302 and 351 cars that could cruise at 80 mph in third gear, and in the bulldust of outback roads, you could spend all day in thrid gear.
The problem's that never happen except in race conditions then migrate to thermal stress on the road, what people think are rod bearing and main bearing issues...they are normally incipent detonation issues.Thats detonation you can't detect.
So bearing finish, linishing sufaces and all that jazz becomes the critical stuff. When people upgrade the conrods, then the problems then become wrist pins and rod and main bearing failure.
This I have leaned from my friends Torana SL/Turbo 3300. Down here in the late 1987 before the share market crash, we Kiwis were frequntly in a rich farming community, and everyone was building there own V8 Holdens and Fords. For one guy, he wanted a Normalair Garret Torana.
You take a stock 3.3 in line six, rebuild it with the best forged Starfire/Bathurst con rods, solid skirt XU1 pistons, clearance it, linish and crack test the parts then add 12 pounds of boost, and the engine survives. Untill his girlfriend Vivan Peck takes it out on a regular basis, and give it a moderate thrashing. From Alexandra to Omakau and back for school each day, a road to die for, full of trucks and give and take zones, so its on and off the gas all the time at 45 to 70 mph all the time. Then it breaks, so he blames his gurl. It broke because of a wrist pin failure that you don't ever see in un boosted engines. The loads to break a wrist pin are H-U-G-E, but 0.866" Holden and BMW and Nissan wrist pins are quite small, and they become critical loads.
Anyway, this is a lot like the Cemical Supercharging nitrous oxide issue. You transfer other problem with engines to lean out related torchdown matters.
I'm not sure if going back to naturally aspirated will look after con rods, but we all assume not having boost will give the engine an easier life. Revs kill engines. If the Monsta its driven like it was, it'll need to be trashed a little more in the mid range unless some trick intake mods are done.
Last edited:
Nothing I can do to stop it....I got nothin to work with.
First of all, the name. Friggin awesome.
Secondly, I know the feeling. Its been below zero for two straight weeks. Ive had zero motivation to be out finding the solution to my problem, and have no $ for any more new parts. My thread is probably on page 4 or 5 by now.
Hah,....and Noobz said it was dumb...
Gotta get a new CT, and a new Avatar....(it is the New year after all).
Starting over with a new N/A setup,.... and possibly a new job.
Well,....I get the engine back today. The machinist said that the direct replacement liners would not go back in the same holes that the old ones came out of. Said something about a poor "press fit". Also went on to say the the new liners he got as a replacement required a larger overbore...( remember,...they already bored this thing .188 the last time).
Personally, the skeptic in me thinks that they just messed up the original install so bad, that when he got the old sleeves out, he couldn't use the replacement ones. Or conversely, on the second time, he messed that up again, and that forced a whole new set of larger ones. There are only two sleeves that fit this engine w/o having to cut a lot of waste off the top...the ones that were in it, and another slightly larger diameter version..
One of the has a .090 wall, the other has a .125 wall. If they had to bore the block to accommodate that larger sleeve, they had to bore my engine....195"
The sleeves are pressed in after the engine is hogged out that big....the whole thing fascinates me. To think you can bore the engine almost 1/4" over, and not have it lose all of its original machine spec'd clearances, and squareness on the main saddle, the deck, and the cam journals is something to worry about..
You can bet I'll make those concerns obvious to machine dude when I see him at 2 today.
To answer the other ambiguity......
Yes,...no more Genius.
This is a low 40's income job. I knew that when they hired me. Originally it was also a 9-6, 40 hour work week with one week day off and Sunday. A fair trade for the income, job description, and the hours.
But they changed stuff mid year last year,.
Increased the hours,..changed the leave time to 7:30. ( occasionally it's much later) changed the pay plan ( actually took away about 2-3k annually)
To work in sales here, the opportunity to make significantly more than what I make is way more than do-able. But you trade away your home life. They simply will not let go of a sale until it's done,..regardless . whether or not there's only one hour left before they close, they'll remain open until they get the last sale out that door that day. I've seen them remain "lights on" till 10 pm at least twice weekly.
Additionally, They were open Sunday, NY's eve, and Monday, NY's day.
A precursor of things to come if you work for Sonic Automotive.
So,....I'm gonna "run in place" for a while,...I'm waiting on a sales offer from Lexus ( but also a Sonic dealership)
And the Chrysler/Jeep/Alfa/Maserati/Fiat dealership down the street ( not a Sonic dealership) wants to talk to me on Monday.
Personally, the skeptic in me thinks that they just messed up the original install so bad, that when he got the old sleeves out, he couldn't use the replacement ones. Or conversely, on the second time, he messed that up again, and that forced a whole new set of larger ones. There are only two sleeves that fit this engine w/o having to cut a lot of waste off the top...the ones that were in it, and another slightly larger diameter version..
One of the has a .090 wall, the other has a .125 wall. If they had to bore the block to accommodate that larger sleeve, they had to bore my engine....195"
The sleeves are pressed in after the engine is hogged out that big....the whole thing fascinates me. To think you can bore the engine almost 1/4" over, and not have it lose all of its original machine spec'd clearances, and squareness on the main saddle, the deck, and the cam journals is something to worry about..
You can bet I'll make those concerns obvious to machine dude when I see him at 2 today.
To answer the other ambiguity......
Yes,...no more Genius.
This is a low 40's income job. I knew that when they hired me. Originally it was also a 9-6, 40 hour work week with one week day off and Sunday. A fair trade for the income, job description, and the hours.
But they changed stuff mid year last year,.
Increased the hours,..changed the leave time to 7:30. ( occasionally it's much later) changed the pay plan ( actually took away about 2-3k annually)
To work in sales here, the opportunity to make significantly more than what I make is way more than do-able. But you trade away your home life. They simply will not let go of a sale until it's done,..regardless . whether or not there's only one hour left before they close, they'll remain open until they get the last sale out that door that day. I've seen them remain "lights on" till 10 pm at least twice weekly.
Additionally, They were open Sunday, NY's eve, and Monday, NY's day.
A precursor of things to come if you work for Sonic Automotive.
So,....I'm gonna "run in place" for a while,...I'm waiting on a sales offer from Lexus ( but also a Sonic dealership)
And the Chrysler/Jeep/Alfa/Maserati/Fiat dealership down the street ( not a Sonic dealership) wants to talk to me on Monday.
Glad you are now happy with the block. Cant remember, but are your new ring gaps still going to work?
- Status