Progress Thread 1993 LX Hatch Progress

[Mac131]

Update. Finally got to put some more miles on it... 35. It cruised around great. However, when I would put it to the floor in first gear it would fall on its face and spit and sputter. Anything up to 3/4 throttle feels fine. If you mash it in a higher gear while cruising it feels pretty good...weird.

Things I have done so far in regards to maintenance:
-Timing is at 11 deg
-New fuel filter
-Fresh fuel
-New autolite 25 plugs gapped at .054"
-New pressure regulator (from AutoZone)
-PCM capacitors
*TPS is at .9 when idling and it appears smooth when I open it with KOEO.

Parts on the way:
-New air intake (stock replica) with K&N filter
-Motorcraft cap, rotor, and coil

It has done this since I got it but until now I didn't really hammer it down in first.

Any thoughts and ideas are appreciated.

 

[nicholase]

I'd probably pull codes to start.

Regarding the timing, after you set it did the timing noticeably change when you plugged the spout back in? So that you know the EEC is capable of timing control.

If you have a fuel pressure gauge you could tape it to the windshield and see if that's an issue when it acts up.

 

[limp]

Where did you find the quiet peaceful road to drive on.... Hard to find anymore...

 

[Mac131]

I'd probably pull codes to start.

Regarding the timing, after you set it did the timing noticeably change when you plugged the spout back in? So that you know the EEC is capable of timing control.

If you have a fuel pressure gauge you could tape it to the windshield and see if that's an issue when it acts up.

I'll pull codes again. I don't think it tripped any a couple weeks ago. Verified timing after tightening the bolt. I do have a fuel pressure gauge mounted to the rail. I could remove it, build a line and tape it to the windshield. I'll have to find some fittings and hose that will work...
The timing changed when pulling or inserting the spout as well. Do these cars have knock sensors?

 

[Mac131]

Where did you find the quiet peaceful road to drive on.... Hard to find anymore...

Right by my house...thankfully. it's a great road to just cruise on. It heads up to a reservoir and gets into some fun turns as you climb the canyon.

 

[Mac131]

Pulled codes...

34- EGR not opening properly. Weird since I have one of those bypass plugs inserted.

67- Neutral safety switch. I know this trips unless you have the clutch pushed in when you run codes.

 

[Mac131]

Codes were KOEO so the 34 is this:

 

[General karthief]

I'm guessing these "performance" chips were a joke?

The post was a joke.....don't know about much about the chips 'cept basic knowledge.
The diode trick keeps the CEL from trip'n, if it's deleted just ignore it.
I think.........

 

[Mac131]

I get a code 31 with it removed and a code 34 with it installed. No CEL when installed. I assume the EGR characteristics will not activate with the code 34? Probably code 31 as well. I looked for answers here and it gets muddy pretty quick.

 

[Mac131]

So...how come my engine freaks out when I run it without the filter? I'm just testing things. I have the cone that attaches directly to the mass air.

 

[General karthief]

Air turbulence likely.

I looked for answers here and it gets muddy pretty quick.

your answer is ignore it. Should have no effect on engine performance.

 

[Mac131]

Air turbulence likely.

your answer is ignore it. Should have no effect on engine performance.

Roger that. Took it for another drive...it falls on its face and sputters when I go WOT. Strange. It cruises around just fine. No shuddering either. Maybe it's that MSD coil or AutoZone fuel regulator.

 

[General karthief]

Codes?
Is the fuel pressure stay'n constant while accelerating?

 

[Mac131]

Only code 34. I'm going to get some fuel line today so I can tape the gauge to the windshield and test it.

 

[nicholase]

Pulled codes...

34- EGR not opening properly. Weird since I have one of those bypass plugs inserted.

I'd have to think unless it was tuned or chipped for the EGR delete it's still gonna set the 34 because it's not seeing the resistance value of the EGR position sensor change when it tries to open it. It just sees the fixed resistance of the dummy plug. So it's trying to open the EGR and doesn't see confirmation that it moved. Then sets the code 34.

I think those plugs just keep the CEL off by not showing an electrical circuit open. So this probably isn't related or causing the symptons you are experiencing.

I get a code 31 with it removed and a code 34 with it installed. No CEL when installed. I assume the EGR characteristics will not activate with the code 34? Probably code 31 as well. I looked for answers here and it gets muddy pretty quick.

That seems normal too.

*Where it gets murky and just for conversation:

As far as when the ECC decides to ignore the EGR thinking there is a problem and abort any fueling or ignition changes I'm not sure. Even if the EGR is physically removed, blocked off, and a dummy plug put in, it still thinks it's there. So there is a point where the EEC decides when it's going to stop trying to open it or disregard any info sent from the position sensor or dummy plug in your case. I don't know when that point is.

A possible problem I could see the dummy plug causing is if it was wired for an incorrect resistance and was showing the EEC a value of partially open EGR and it was trying to adapt to EGR flow when there wasn't any.

a) I would think you'd have driveability problems all over the place because it would think it's always open or partially open.

b) I'm not sure the EEC does attempt to alter fuel / ignition if it sees the position sensor indicate flow when it is not currently trying to open it. That might be a point where it disregards because it's getting conflicting info.


I'm not thinking there is anything here. But, out of curiosity I'd probably unplug the EGR position dummy plug to force the code 31 and illuminate the CEL in an attemt to confirm it is aborting any fueling or ignition changes related to the EGR. Then take it for a ride and see if anything changed. If not move on to the next thing.

I'm interested to see what your FP is when you get the gauge rigged up.

 

[89ripper]

EGR delete plugs are for check engine lights, needs a tune to be turned off in ecu

 

[Mac131]

Update... Decided to unplug the EGR resistor plug and hook up my fuel gauge to a hose and went for a drive. Here are the results:

Idle with FPR vacuum line connected. 34 PSI.

Idle with FPR vacuum line removed. 40 PSI.

WOT. 40 PSI.

Man it really spits and sputters at WOT...crazy.

Thoughts?

 

[89ripper]

Update... Decided to unplug the EGR resistor plug and hook up my fuel gauge to a hose and went for a drive. Here are the results:

Idle with FPR vacuum line connected. 34 PSI.

Idle with FPR vacuum line removed. 40 PSI.

WOT. 40 PSI.

Man it really spits and sputters at WOT...crazy.

Thoughts?

only a hit and run post for now, but egr should be a non factor at WOT. I have code 34 set and dont experience what you have. Be back soon

 

[Mac131]

Just for kicks I measured the volume the pump produces at idle. I filled a 1 liter bottle in 15 seconds. That equates to 240lph. That's a lot. But not sure that would create an issue. Still has stock injectors. I bet the previous motor in this car made more power, so they upgraded the pump...just a guess.

 

[Mac131]

I decided to put in a new distributer (complete assembly) and a new coil from O'REILLY'S. Car spit and sputtered just trying to drive it. Sounded like it had a cam at idle. Timing was 10 degrees BTC. Put my original MSD coil back on and the car now drives like it did before...so the coil they sold me is junk and my original distributer is verified as good. Could still be the coil. It sounds like it is too lean when I floor it. Once I hit 4k rpm it's popping and sputtering.

Another thing I noticed is the intake is loud. Sounds like it's sucking a golf ball through a garden hose at times. The noise fluctuates too.